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| Equipment seen at ABR, photos here | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jan 5 2010, 07:15 PM (4,105 Views) | |
| semntrails | Jan 21 2010, 11:24 PM Post #16 |
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I talked to Eric about the blue drag today - the picture Sherpa Man posted is what it should (could) look like, there are also some fixed teeth you can add in place of the paddles. All the mounting holes are so you can put the paddles where you want it. For the Rhino and Ranger - the Rhino is 1190 lbs (stock) and the Ranger is 1262 so they should have about the same ground pressure. The Ranger is 6" wider though so depending on your drag size cover the tracks would be tough. They both had lots of power for pulling although it felt like the Ranger was working harder - or the drive belt was slipping a little. Having the locking axles on the Rhino helped it to pull a steeper hill without slipping. I double checked on the ATV's neither the CanAM nor the Grizzly had power steering, but the Grizzly had a newer version of the 4s tracks so they turned much easier. Attached is a pdf of a bunch of ATV/UTV options and their specs, along with some prices - some of the accessory prices I estimated because I couldn't find an actual price on the web or I found an after market price. |
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| Sherpa-man | Jan 22 2010, 12:08 AM Post #17 |
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Sharp eye! It's a Venture Light. This groomer pulls very easily so you can get by with less than 20" of track, does a great job except it is not a Ginzu.... it's not designed to handle hard pack or ice conditions. You can add a tracksetter and a set of knives to mount ahead of the tracksetter to help you get a track in in firmer snow. |
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| arly | Jan 22 2010, 09:30 AM Post #18 |
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When we test drove ATV's with tracks at ABR a couple years ago, afterward we both thought the steering was stressful enough, we dropped the idea of using them. Since then we always ask operators, what they thought of steering whatever model of tracks and ATV they have. As you state, the tracks are being improved as is the steering on some machines. Thanks for the research semntrails. |
| http://keweenawnordic.org/ [/url] keweenawnordicskiclub.blogspot.com [/url] | |
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| Steve.M | Jan 22 2010, 09:52 AM Post #19 |
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Funny you mention steering- you should try steering when you forget to have the rig in 4X4!!!! Yeah, I did that bonehead move one day this winter-I for the life of me could not figure out why it was steering so hard! Dahhhhhhh-the 4 wheel drive wasn't pressed it. I was still actually able to pull a loaded Ginzu thru 4" of snow like that (not for real long!) just with the rear tracks driving it! I highly recommend running tracked atvs with 4 wheel drive ON!
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| semntrails | Jan 22 2010, 09:56 AM Post #20 |
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I will say even though the specs only say the Polaris is 6" wider than the Rhino, the Ranger looks and feels noticably bigger. I liked the roomy operator area on it but for grooming driving the smaller size on the Rhino seemed nicer. The Rhino had a Ginzu with an extended tongue, I think if they had taken the tailgate off like they had on the Ranger it might have been possible to see the teeth although just barely. |
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| arly | Jan 22 2010, 10:40 AM Post #21 |
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Machine width might not be a concern for many folks here, especially those doing the "sissy*" type of trails. For our narrow ones, we appreciate narrow.. We even have a 8ft wide board walk with a corner in it. Previously we'd heard negative comments from UTV groomers not on this forum, that they couldn't see their implements teeth so we became sensitive to that problem. But while test driving the Rhino, we found we could see the implements teeth just by looking back out the door. Maybe a cab would end that option?? Of course the Ginsu we were pulling was wider than the Rhino was. Just food for thought. You do know that the hitch extension was a necessity? If so, maybe others don't. The tracks extend out the back lots and they'd hit the ginsu while turning a corner without it.*skating trails Edited by arly, Jan 22 2010, 11:29 AM.
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| http://keweenawnordic.org/ [/url] keweenawnordicskiclub.blogspot.com [/url] | |
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| Steve.M | Jan 22 2010, 11:42 AM Post #22 |
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When using a regular Ginzu or G2 hitch, we use a 12" extension on the 2" receiver. Now they both have goosenecks on so track clearance is not an issue. |
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| arly | Jan 22 2010, 11:58 AM Post #23 |
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[/quote]When using a regular Ginzu or G2 hitch, we use a 12" extension on the 2" receiver. Now they both have goosenecks on so track clearance is not an issue.[/quote] Hummmm what about placing the ball higher and on your rear rack?? (assuming your Grizzly has one) Or in the bed of a UTV?? The extension Eric at ABR had built for the Rhino looked to be placing lots of stress on its 2" receiver. What did semntrails think?? The camoplast UTV 4s pods also extend out the back further than yours do. Edited by arly, Jan 22 2010, 12:10 PM.
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| http://keweenawnordic.org/ [/url] keweenawnordicskiclub.blogspot.com [/url] | |
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| semntrails | Jan 22 2010, 12:36 PM Post #24 |
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The tracks on the UTV's extended ~34" behind the center of the axle - of course they sloped down so you gain a little clearance that way. I didn't look to see what kind of support the beds of the UTV's had but some sort of ball in the bed might work. I don't think the racks on most of the atv's are strong enough. I did wonder about creating a tie bar that would go from the hitch extension to the rack on an ATV or the bottom of the Box on a UTV for more support. Yeah both UTV's had long extended hitches, but one of the 9' Ginzu had a normal tongue on it ~1' long, while the 7' Ginzu had a long ~2 1/2' long on it so in addition to the extended hitch you also had a longer tongue on the Ginzu - the switched around which machine was pulling which but when I drove the Rhino it had the Ginzu with the longer tongue, I think without the tailgate you could see the teeth then - or look out the door if you don't have doors on it. On the Polaris I couldn't see the teeth on either one but on the long tongue Ginzu is was close. With the 7' Ginzu you had to lean out the door to see the teeth on the 9' Ginzu you could just look back out the door without having to lean way out. Greg |
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| Steve.M | Jan 22 2010, 01:09 PM Post #25 |
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When using a regular Ginzu or G2 hitch, we use a 12" extension on the 2" receiver. Now they both have goosenecks on so track clearance is not an issue.[/quote] Hummmm what about placing the ball higher and on your rear rack?? (assuming your Grizzly has one) Or in the bed of a UTV?? The extension Eric at ABR had built for the Rhino looked to be placing lots of stress on its 2" receiver. What did semntrails think?? The camoplast UTV 4s pods also extend out the back further than yours do.[/quote]You couldn't really mount the ball on the Grizzly rack-it would be too high and the rack is not strong enough. I've looked at the stock Yamaha 2" receiver hitch and with the extention, I was a little worried about how strong it would be, but so far no issues. I think a couple braces running from the hitch up to another location on the machine would help-but again. I don't know if it's needed. As a side note, when we looked at UTVs, I was worried about being able to see the groomer behind. Interesting to get some of this feedback. |
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| semntrails | Jan 22 2010, 02:10 PM Post #26 |
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One of the guys there with a UTV said it's more like grooming with a Piston Bully - you go by feel and what it looks like out the far back rather than worrying about how high/low the teeth are. I'm sure that works but if you have volunteers that might groom every other week as they come up in the rotation, getting them to groom by feel will be tough I think - that is the case we work with. The guys that have the UTV's with cabs said you don't need the extra heater the engine keeps it warm enough in the cab to groom in a long sleeve t-shirt once it warms up. |
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| semntrails | Jan 22 2010, 02:13 PM Post #27 |
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Talked to a dealer today who said CanAM changed the heat shield design for 2009 or 2010 so hopefully the seats won't melt anymore but who knows, not sure I want to spend $10K to find out. |
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| arly | Jan 22 2010, 04:03 PM Post #28 |
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Was that the fellow from Minocqua Winter Park?? If so I chatted with him too. I believe he said they had a Ranger and they really loved it. The "feel" of tooth depth makes be nervous. We try running our Ginsu tooth depth about the same to match the pans shoe depth. If you go shallower it seems to leave voids in the tracks. To deep and you dig up chunks or blow extra material out the wings. Maybe I'm theorizing this to much. Oh and many of folks we spoke with (not on this forum) said they usually didn't need a heater too.
Edited by arly, Jan 22 2010, 04:10 PM.
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| http://keweenawnordic.org/ [/url] keweenawnordicskiclub.blogspot.com [/url] | |
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| air19 | Jan 22 2010, 04:37 PM Post #29 |
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How bout setting the tracksetter in the down position. I use a small G2 with the tracksetter and their is a fine line in getting it set just at the right height. I usually watch the swing arc of the actuator and I know when it goes past a certain point to stop. Now how am I going to do that in a UTV? On my 20Km trail network when I'm setting track, the actuator is going up and down 50 times a day for the hills. I have a Ranger but I haven't thought about using it for grooming. It is a great summer trail maintenance machine. Mine is 10 years old and it's the most important machine on our forest farm and trail network, more so than the tractor, the snowmobile, anything else. Nothing better than having two guys go out and do trail work together for productivity. I'm about a year away from getting a tracked ATV. For winter grooming it's not a two person job, so the only UTV advantage is the cab and the carry over into summer work. Yes about 1 grooming day in 5 it's blowing hard outside the snow is coming down and I'm just trying to see straight on my VK Pro with my ski goggles on. Those days I dream about being inside a cab with the wiper going. But the rest of the time, I like being out in the air and seeing exactly what is going on behind me whenever I want - give me a sled or an ATV So I'm just waiting to get my Grizzly with the latest Tatou tracks. I know Arly already has a Rhino, so it certainly makes sense for him to just pursue the right tracks. But why are so many people trying to make the UTV the solution, when a good ATV/Track setup is already a known? |
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| Steve.M | Jan 22 2010, 05:08 PM Post #30 |
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Agreed-I don't mind the ATV, I dress for it and it's never been bad. The windshield and heated grips make it pretty comfy. I wondered about the UTVs also with a cab-wondered how loud it would be. In our 95 ASV Track Truck-it was t-shirt warm inside, but really rattley and loud. Wore ear plugs in that all the time. I had a "cab" on my old ATV used for plowing and hated it-hard to see and just not user friendly (I realize it was nothing like the nice hard cabs for UTVs. Again, being out in the air and being able to move and see is something I like about the atv, plus it's a better seated position than hours and hours on a sled. Just my .02 worth. |
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GroomingEquipment.pdf (133.77 KB)




Oh and many of folks we spoke with (not on this forum) said they usually didn't need a heater too.
4:30 AM Jul 11