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Lazarus Alliance - debate
Topic Started: Apr 6 2011, 04:14 PM (714 Views)
sedge
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Admin Slave
We currently have an alliance with Lazarus. I'd suggest removing one bit (in red) and adding another (blue) to reflect the current state of the region.

Quote:
 
Preamble:
We the sovereign regions of Lazarus and The Rejected Realms in order to strengthen relations between our two regions agree to the following terms outlined in this document.

Article I
Both signatories recognize that the Lazarene government according to the Lazarene constitution is the legitimate government of the region Lazarus and that Kandarin the Rejected Realms government according to the Rejected Realms constitution, is the legitimate ruler of The Rejected Realms. Both signatories recognize each other as sovereign entities.

Article II
Both signatories ensure continuing diplomatic relations and agree to open embassies for the other party on their soil. The signatories promise to ensure the continued existence and use of these embassies as long as the alliance prevails.

Article III
Both signatories agree to provide military aid to defend the security and sovereignty of the other party’s region. They will provide this military aid at the request of the other party, or if the signatory believes that a state of emergency exists in which the other party is unable to request military aid. Both signatories also agree to support each other in times of war.

Article IV
Both signatories agree to provide intelligence information at the request of the other party, as long this information does not harm their own security or jeopardize ongoing intelligence gathering operations. Both signatories are obliged to provide intelligence information to the other party if it refers to an immediate security concern to that party. Although both signatories must agree not to use the other party to harm the security or sovereignty of another region.

Article V
Both signatories may work on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III and both agree that closer military co-operation should be encouraged. However there is no obligation for the signatories to work together on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III.

Article VI
If any or both regions fail to abide by the following terms articles set forth by this alliance, either signatory may withdraw, but must give a weeks notice to the other party before it becomes void and both signatories agree to attempt seek a diplomatic solution before withdrawing.

Signed:
North Harmoneia, Lazarene Delegate
Emperor Matthuis, Lazarene Foreign Affairs Minister
Kandarin, Rejected Realms Delegate


Because we have a new constitution, government etc., I'd recommend that if we want to keep this, we talk to Lazarus about amending the alliance as described above, and then vote to re-affirm it (so it can be signed by the Assembly of the Rejected Realms).

Thoughts?
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Dalimbar
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Contributor
Looks good to me.
Dalimbar
Delegate (Ret.) of Osiris
Delegate (Ret.) of The North Pacific
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Naivetry
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Spammer
Yep.
[nation]Kandarin[/nation] the Younger/[nation]Lirantha[/nation]
~
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Spartan Termopylae
The Fool on the Hill
Why not?
When you play the game of thrones, you win, or you die

Liebe ist fur alle da
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unibot
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Chief Propagandist
Aye.
Posted Image
Former Delegate of The Rejected Realms
Former Editor-In-Chief, Maestro

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sedge
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Posted in Lazarus about it, and they seem open to it, though they'll have to ratify the changes too.

This is the updated version of it (slightly different to above):

Quote:
 
Preamble:
We the sovereign regions of Lazarus and The Rejected Realms in order to strengthen relations between our two regions agree to the following terms outlined in this document.

Article I
Both signatories recognize that the Lazarene government according to the Lazarene constitution is the legitimate government of the region Lazarus and that Kandarin the Rejected Realms government according to the Rejected Realms constitution, is the legitimate ruler government of The Rejected Realms. Both signatories recognize each other as sovereign entities.

Article II
Both signatories ensure continuing diplomatic relations and agree to open embassies for the other party on their soil. The signatories promise to ensure the continued existence and use of these embassies as long as the alliance prevails.

Article III
Both signatories agree to provide military aid to defend the security and sovereignty of the other party’s region. They will provide this military aid at the request of the other party, or if the signatory believes that a state of emergency exists in which the other party is unable to request military aid. Both signatories also agree to support each other in times of war.

Article IV
Both signatories agree to provide intelligence information at the request of the other party, as long this information does not harm their own security or jeopardize ongoing intelligence gathering operations. Both signatories are obliged to provide intelligence information to the other party if it refers to an immediate security concern to that party. Although both signatories must agree not to use the other party to harm the security or sovereignty of another region.

Article V
Both signatories may work on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III and both agree that closer military co-operation should be encouraged. However there is no obligation for the signatories to work together on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III.

Article VI
If any or both regions fail to abide by the following terms articles set forth by this alliance, either signatory may withdraw, but must give a weeks notice to the other party before it becomes void and both signatories agree to attempt seek a diplomatic solution before withdrawing.

Signed:
North Harmoneia, Lazarene Delegate
Emperor Matthuis, Lazarene Foreign Affairs Minister
Kandarin, Rejected Realms Delegate
The Assembly of The Rejected Realms


If there are no further objections, I'd like to vote on ratifying it.
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Spartan Termopylae
The Fool on the Hill
Uh, if their delegate and FA guy signs, shouldn't ours? As opposed to the Assembly as a whole? We ratify, you sign?
When you play the game of thrones, you win, or you die

Liebe ist fur alle da
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sedge
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I don't really know how their system of government works - they may only need a delegate/FA Minister to sign to approve an alliance. For us, we're constitutionally obliged to have the Assembly approve it - and since that's the case, there seems to be little point in having someone else sign instead.
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Dyr Nasad
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Loyalist
I think the EC in laz may have to look at it as well, and its DYP now, not Harmie
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sedge
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Yeah, I think their signatures will be replaced by "The Emerald Council of Lazarus".
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Spartan Termopylae
The Fool on the Hill
Its still to be signed by representatives on behalf if the individual governments, not by the entire governmental body.

As in we approve, you sign on our behalf. That doesnt go against the constitution.
Edited by Spartan Termopylae, Apr 10 2011, 07:46 PM.
When you play the game of thrones, you win, or you die

Liebe ist fur alle da
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Drop Your Pants
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Blame Fratt
Thanks to this i've had to go read our own constitution and bring up problems, who can i blame? :P Won't affect the treaty in general just who signs it from our end.
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Drop Your Pants
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Blame Fratt
You might hate us but the version we're voting on is different to yours, we only just finished changing it on our side. There were a few issues with our constitution :P
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sedge
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Admin Slave
Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. What's the text of yours then?
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Drop Your Pants
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Blame Fratt
Quote:
 
Preamble:
We the sovereign regions of Lazarus and The Rejected Realms in order to strengthen relations between our two regions agree to the following terms outlined in this document.

Article I
Both signatories recognize that the Lazarene government according to the Lazarene constitution, hereafter known as Mandate 6.0, is the legitimate government of the region Lazarus and that the Rejected Realms government according to the Rejected Realms constitution, is the legitimate government of The Rejected Realms. Both signatories recognize each other as sovereign entities.

Article II
Both signatories ensure continuing diplomatic relations and agree to open embassies for the other party on their soil, this includes the respective regional forums as well as the in-game region page. The signatories promise to ensure the continued existence and use of these embassies as long as the alliance prevails.

Article III
Both signatories agree to provide military aid to defend the security and sovereignty of the other party’s region. They will provide this military aid at the request of the other party, or if the signatory believes that a state of emergency exists in which the other party is unable to request military aid. Both signatories also agree to support each other in times of war.

Article IV
Both signatories agree to provide intelligence information at the request of the other party, as long this information does not harm their own security or jeopardize ongoing intelligence gathering operations. Both signatories are obliged to provide intelligence information to the other party if it refers to an immediate security concern to that party. Although both signatories must agree not to use the other party to harm the security or sovereignty of another region.

Article V
Both signatories may work on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III and both agree that closer military co-operation should be encouraged. However there is no obligation for the signatories to work together on military operations beyond those ensured in Article III.

Article VI
If any or both regions fail to abide by the following terms articles set forth by this alliance, either signatory may withdraw, but must give a weeks notice to the other party before it becomes void and both signatories agree to attempt seek a diplomatic solution before withdrawing.

Signed:
Drop Your Pants, Delegate of Lazarus
The Emerald Council of Lazarus
The Assembly of The Rejected Realms


spec
 
Mandate 6.0 is now specified as our Constitution, in-game embassies are referred to, and the Emerald Council is added as a signatory.
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