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| The use of Kandarin | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 19 2011, 06:11 AM (1,337 Views) | |
| CrazyGirl | Jan 20 2011, 07:38 AM Post #16 |
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RRA Commander
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Well, lets see. I suppose I can add two points here. 1: Wham has been open about who he is. You still refuse to give information on your identity. 2: I am a part of the Rejected Realms History, having been here since 2003 and playing a role in it. |
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| Spartan Termopylae | Jan 20 2011, 12:40 PM Post #17 |
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The Fool on the Hill
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Doesn't really matter which, I guess, as you are both. But Anur-Sanur, old chap, I think there is one thing to say on your incessant dislike of the Kandarin situation: you are treating Kandarin as a personality. It's what we like to call personification, and it is a wonderful tool while writing. However, in this sense, treat it like an actual nation. The US under Obama isn't a completely different place than under Bush. Just going in a slightly different direction. The UK under the ConDems isn't really any different, in real terms, than it was under Labour. So treat the original Kandarin owner as Bush and Naivetry as Obama. It's a new age, my friend, and neither one of us was here during the old age, so can we say what is better or worse for it? |
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When you play the game of thrones, you win, or you die Liebe ist fur alle da | |
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| Whamabama | Jan 20 2011, 11:46 PM Post #18 |
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Questionably Evil
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I just want to point out a few things. To switch to Lirantha. Someone else would have to either take Liranthra, or Kandarin. Lirantha would have to tart up, everybody knows this howerever. No news there. If there wasn't a threat in the region, then this wouldn't be such a big deal, but it becomes a big deal when lirantha not only has to tart past Kandarin, but anouther nation tarting for the delegate seat. Also because there is the threat, Kandarin would have to keep tarting in order that the threat nation who has a big head start doesn't get there first. Which in other words is one giant logistical nightmare. One that will last a long long time. I told Nai if she did want to switch, I could take one of the nations. I do have experience in such things. Edited by Whamabama, Jan 21 2011, 12:46 AM.
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Those who don't create, dictate The structure of our world and preach hate | |
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| Anur-Sanur | Jan 21 2011, 02:32 AM Post #19 |
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Dedicated
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why is it such a nightmare? someone can take Lirantha now, and Naivetry can keep doing what she is doing with Kandarin and stay ahead of Pristine. I think you will find Lirantha will gain endorsements with amazing speed and will surpass Pristine, as no one should hold out on endorsing her. you could just start tarting now or as a daily routine, it really doesn't have to be portrayed as such a huge undertaking. the difficulty will be closing the gap but for now you could easily get an initial 30,40 endorsements just by tarting. |
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| Biyah | Jan 21 2011, 03:26 AM Post #20 |
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High Priest of the Cult
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Because both run the risk of being deleted as multi's, once the switch is made. One of them would have to drop WA for 24 hours before the switch( which would mean Kandarin) before Naivetry could take control of the second WA. And the person with the second would then have to wait 24 hours (minimum) before picking up another WA. So for at least 24 hours, Naivetry would not be in control of the region, at least. |
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| Felasia | Jan 21 2011, 06:46 AM Post #21 |
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Knight of Equility
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I don't really care either way. Naivetry is the delegate now and she is allow to use whichever nation to represent herself in-game as WA delegate of the Rejected Realms. I elect her and not Lirantha or Kanderin(the nation that is) so as long as she control the RC then it is not really my concern. |
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| Anur-Sanur | Jan 21 2011, 03:31 PM Post #22 |
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Dedicated
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Oh lord, 24 hours whatever will we do? |
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| CrazyGirl | Jan 21 2011, 07:00 PM Post #23 |
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RRA Commander
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How about actually replying to people's arguments? |
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| Biyah | Jan 22 2011, 11:45 AM Post #24 |
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High Priest of the Cult
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Yes, indeed. And let me raise the ante a bit. 24 hours is enough to turn TRR into a bloody warzone, when every defender and raider in the area jumps in for the hell of it, it'll be a fuggin circus. Chaos unleashed. Listen, idiot child, and you might learn. Nee is only a handful of endorsements off. You do NOT just hand off a delegacy in that situation. Ever. Period. And if you were to use your head, you'd realize that... or can you not stand the thought that you could be wrong? Whatever, it's your malfunction, not ours. Oh, and by the by, why are you making a run for the delegacy, hmm? This action of yours not only makes your whole argument suspect, but raises the question of why you are so desperate to get a solid and stable nation out of the delegacy. Your argument is weak, your persistence silly, and yet you DO persist. A suspicious man would think you have another agenda. *quirks an eyebrow*
Edited by Biyah, Jan 22 2011, 12:05 PM.
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| Anur-Sanur | Jan 22 2011, 05:53 PM Post #25 |
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Dedicated
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yes what treachery i am committing, returning to 56 endorsements. The same number I had when I said I would participate in the elections and stay under 60 endorsements. This was when the delegate had close to 90 endorsements. I have stated my intentions with my endorsement count and have adhered to my pledge, so your list means nothing. Furthermore, your argument is completely idiotic (@CG, I am addressing his argument 24 hours was his thing). Let's break down your argument: "And let me raise the ante a bit. 24 hours is enough to turn TRR into a bloody warzone, when every defender and raider in the area jumps in for the hell of it, it'll be a fuggin circus. Chaos unleashed." this is it? First of all "every defender"? Is that supposed to be a threat? Wouldn't we want defenders rushing in to endorse Lirantha? Aren't we FRA? Doesn't that bring in numbers that raiders could only dream of? You claim my argument is weak but your argument is the weak one. You can't cite any threat. What raiding organization would be interested in getting quashed by locals and FRA combined? And second why have we accepted your premise? Couldn't Kandarin be dropped and the switch be made after Lirantha got the delegacy? Whoever Nai trusted with the Lirantha could surely be trusted for the delegacy for a day. Kandarin- Nai Lirantha- Someone else. That person gets the delegacy, Nai drops Kandarin, then 24 hours later switch happens. Delegacy stays with this community. Your idea is the idiotic one, "Nai" herself not being in control for 24 hours isn't a bad thing because Lirantha would be controlled by a trusted friend/member. So you can calm down. Nee isn't going to get it because there are holdouts, that's how tarting works. You quickly gain endorsements from people who aren't really involved in the region's politics and just swap up. Then there are usually holdouts, in the case of TRR I would estimate them at 10-15, and that math works for were Pristine is sitting. Those nations won't hold out for Lirantha. It can be done, and I believe if we stopped talking about it and actually started doing it then we'd be finished sooner than we realized. |
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| Biyah | Jan 22 2011, 06:43 PM Post #26 |
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High Priest of the Cult
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*chuckles* Alright pup, you want to play? Ok. We'll play.
I didn't say you were committing treachery. I invite you to reread what I wrote. In fact, let me re-paste it for you, so you don't hurt yourself looking: Oh, and by the by, why are you making a run for the delegacy, hmm? This action of yours not only makes your whole argument suspect, but raises the question of why you are so desperate to get a solid and stable nation out of the delegacy. Your argument is weak, your persistence silly, and yet you DO persist. A suspicious man would think you have another agenda. Note the bolded text. I said a suspicious man would think you had another agenda... so, do you? It surely seems so. Time will tell if you are engaging in behavior that we'll have to kick your ass for. Now continuing on... please, LETS break down this argument! Wheeee!
Um. Raiders love to take part in plans that cause chaos, and Nee is very good at picking times when no defenders are about in numbers. How do I know this? I helped teach her what to look for, and she knows almost all of them personally anyway. I've used raiders several times in takeovers, Nee has used them no less than seven times. I don't think you know who Nee really is... or what she's managed to do in this game. Come to think of it, I don't think you know who a single one of us arguing with you really are, or what we've managed to do in this game. However, lets continue. I already knew you were a nitwit, but all this proves just how ignorant you really are. Let me bring out the 'Defending and Political Theory for Dummies' manual. If you'd ever seen a war in TRR, or any feeder for that matter, You'd know they get ugly in a hurry. I did not once say that defenders were a bad thing, I was one myself (and we'll get to that later *patpat*). The point is, if the Defenders arrive, that means that the invaders are already here. Which means that we'd see propaganda flying every which way, we'd see Defender and Invader leads going up and down in the Endo count. We'd have to fight the FRA to make sure OUR delegate stayed delegate. Yes, you heard me right, for as much as the FRA claims to be the God of Defenders, there have been mistakes and serious disagreements in the past. Furthermore, this is TRR, there are no bans. If the raiders get squashed, they just leave and wait for another day when less defenders are on. There are no military tactics in TRR, no sneaking around is necessary, all you need is patience and a good tarting message. We're lucky insofar as Nai is very, VERY persuasive, and has managed to keep the seat. Point being, it would become an epic political headache. It would disturb the peace of the region, it would make The Rejected Realms a WAR ZONE. Get those two words through your head, because I don't think you quite grasp the significance of them.
Oh yes, absolutely brilliant!. Half the bruhaha in the last three months came about because D gave the password of Kandarin to Naivetry. It lead to arguments, accusations and general bad blood all around. It was a direct cause, in fact, of the elections we just underwent. PERFECT! LETS DO IT AGAIN! WHEEE! Let's hand off the password of Lirantha to someone else, and let them take the delegacy for a minimum of 24 hours - leading to more distrust. It doesn't matter how much Naivetry trusted the person, the rest of the also have to accept that said person would be in charge of the region for that length of time. And in that 24 hours, in come the invaders... defenders... and all the mercenaries that the game has to offer. This leads us back to our first point, about chaos and whatnot. If you need another example, I can beat you upside the head with the Dummies manual until it's clear.
My dear boy, sit down next to Uncle Biyah and try to pull some wax out of your ears, k? Right here, by my knee. *patpat* I am The Federation of Biyah, I have been raiding or defending since 2003. I was one of Pope Hope's right hand men in The ADN and Nasicournia. I have crashed three Feeders, and innumerable UCRS, both in the name of Liberation or straight Invasion. I don't say this to toot my own horn, but to make very clear that I know just how the hell tarting works. I've done it a few times ![]() Now, I'm going to teach you something new. In addition to tarting, there is Raiding and/or military maneuvers. *GASP* Nee can have the delegacy within hours, if she convinces one of several people she knows that they should bring their friends and help her get to the cap. In fact, when Nee (and crew, including me) took over The East Pacific: We hit the last of the cap by bringing in Gatesville, The Lone Wolves United, etc. And we managed to turn the FRA away, and confuse them enough that they didn't engage in time. And even if they had, we'd still have won, raiders can pull more numbers than you're giving them credit for. Nee is still very good friends with all of the above, and a few others. Which means, if she's properly convincing, she could surpass Nai in almost no time. THIS is why Nai, CG et all are so worried about what is going on right now. Sure, Nee is probably close to her natural cap (those are the hold outs you're talking about), but she CAN and WILL be getting help. This is a given, it's just a matter of when. She never goes into battle unless she has backup. Ever. And before you ask why she hasn't brought them in, scroll up again and read about timing, catching the region when there are few defenders online. Wash, rinse, repeat... until you get it through your head. This isn't rocket science I'm talking about, this is basic NS Military Theory. We've been playing with this for years. And it's something you've proven you have absolutely no grasp of. Are there any other foolish statements you'd like to make? I'll remind you that you are in the company of some of the most successful Defenders and Raiders of all time in this game. We were the core of the ADN, RLA and FRA at one point or another, some of us were in high command of ALL, ACC, CDA, RKKA - the list of alphabet soup goes on and on. We all know what we're talking about when it comes to regional security. Love and Kisses ~B Edit: Fixing a quote Edited by Biyah, Jan 23 2011, 04:51 AM.
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| Anur-Sanur | Jan 22 2011, 09:47 PM Post #27 |
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Dedicated
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Here is how I see this as of now. You obviously have history and experience, I have never disputed that. However, the weight of your experience gives you an authority on some some of the statements you made which I can not hope to challenge. However you represent one view, there are others just as storied as yourself that may see things differently. I will be doing some research before I address you again. I will just say I am not as ignorant of NS history as you would like to think, but our point of views are certainly very different. The only thing I will say now is that you seem to have confidence in everyone's abilities but your own, but our community here. You cite your accomplishments, but these are used to persuade us of what we can not do rather than what we can do. If our community has nations like Biyah, CG, Sedge, Nai, even nations that perhaps extend farther out of the current group like DFD, why is it you constantly rank what we can do below what an invader will do. It seems in assessing the skill or talent, we would have the advantage, but you seem to pick the other team. It just seems if you are going to not even discuss how it would work but say the whole idea is foolish, you simply say that our current community is incapable, that we're not good enough to effect the change we want. In my view this only serves to lessen yourself and anyone who takes part in the community, which isn't fair to the rest of us. this is just my general view, it is not really an argument. I will address your points once I have reacquainted myself with the history and have gotten second opinions. |
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| Biyah | Jan 22 2011, 09:57 PM Post #28 |
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High Priest of the Cult
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You've missed the point completely. Again. Someone who believes in stability does not tempt fate, meaning you don't make a delegate switch with an experienced swapper less than a dozen endos behind. I don't see what is so hard to grasp about this concept. It would be a different story if there were 30 endorsements between the delegate and everyone else, which is usually TRR's operating level. I know we're all good. We could take back the region, I have -no- doubts. However, unless we called in every defender in the region to start with (which is usually bad form, it ties up the defenders for legit missions), we'd have a mess to sort out. I don't like inviting chaos. I spent a very long time trying to kill chaos. Hence, the point of all this is, there is NO reason to remove Kandarin from the seat when both nations are owned by the same person anyway. On a side note, I dare you to find an experienced defender-type who says 'go for it', in regards to doing an unnecessary del switch in the midst of an active threat. ~B Edited by Biyah, Jan 22 2011, 09:57 PM.
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| Whamabama | Jan 22 2011, 10:01 PM Post #29 |
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Questionably Evil
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You won't find this one who thinks a change right now is a good idea. I also have a good deal of experience in this kind of thing as most of you know. |
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Those who don't create, dictate The structure of our world and preach hate | |
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| Felasia | Jan 23 2011, 03:25 AM Post #30 |
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Knight of Equility
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I am not even going to bother with arguing the point or discussion, but the fact is fairly simple, Anur-Sanur. You are currently arguing over the stability and security of the delegacy of a feeder with Biyah. Who should I listen to? The one who have vast experience over this matter and have already engineered a takeover of a feeder with eject and ban button... or you? Seriously, this is no-brainier. |
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12:33 AM Jul 11