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| 2010 men's Olympic hockey tournament | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 8 2010, 04:45 PM (2,585 Views) | |
| raconteur | Feb 16 2010, 08:53 AM Post #31 |
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Hobbes your opus is a true work of art. Excellent work and I find it hard to really add anything to that. My question is when does the men's hockey tournament begin? The women's event is already underway but you would thnk that with so many group games to be played that it would have begun by now, 4 days into the Olympics. Second question is what arenas are being used besides the Vancouver Canucks home? |
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| ursus arctos | Feb 16 2010, 09:07 AM Post #32 |
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It starts today, raconteur. Almost all of the men's matches will be played at BC Place (the Canucks' home), but there will be a couple at the University of British Columbia (which is where many of the women's matches have been played). Today's matches: Canada - Norway US - Switzerland Russia - Latvia |
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| raconteur | Feb 16 2010, 09:16 AM Post #33 |
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Grazie ursus. I guess we could expect the Latvians to be fired up to play the Russians today. |
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| Gunners | Feb 16 2010, 12:15 PM Post #34 |
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Great job, Hobbes. |
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| ursus arctos | Feb 16 2010, 02:30 PM Post #35 |
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Good result from the US men in the tournament opener. If they beat the Norwegians (which they should do fairly easily), they are through to the next round no matter what happens against Canada. As hobbes (I think) mentioned above, a problem with this format is that it encourages the strong countries to run up the score on the relative minnows, and Norway's three turns as the ducks in the shooting gallery begin tonight. |
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| hobbes | Feb 17 2010, 12:48 AM Post #36 |
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® from Tuesday US 3 Swiss 1 A pretty good opener for the U.S. The Swiss were playing their game — clogging the neutral zone, containing and forcing turnovers — pretty well until a bad clear by Raphael Diaz was pounced on by Bobby Ryan who finished quickly and ruthlessly. After that the U.S. dominated the second period, but got sloppy in the third. The US lines surprised me a little: Kane-Statsny-Parise is a nice combo and while they didn’t score I thought were dangerous and had a good game. The Swiss were playing to not allow odd-man rushes which didn’t help this line, but they were surprisingly dominant on the cycle. When the chemistry comes they're going to be very tough. Kessel-Pavelski-Malone were pretty quiet and I thought Kessel in particular didn’t play well. Langenbrunner-Kessler-Brown did their job defensively and were physical without really being as punishing as I expected. They should be the shutdown group, but didn’t have much of a challenge against the Swiss. The fourth line of Ryan-Callahan-Backes was fantastic. They led the way physically, they scored twice and killed on the cycle. Late in the first Chris Drury got his first shift on this line and they had a fantastic shift. Then on Drury’s second shift (and they rotated who he filled in for) Ryan scored the opener. All four of those guys were going today. I thought the U.S. did a nice job of being physical and getting to the net. The Swiss pushed back and didn’t back down. They’re more physical then you expect traditionally, so pushing them around was no small feat, but I thought the US dominated physically and that helped them get other areas of their game going. I totally forgot about the subplot from last year when Backes broke Julien Sprunger’s neck with a relatively innocent hit at the worlds last year. Backes was suspended and tossed, but it wasn’t as vicious as it sounded. Sprunger just got back in time for the Olympics, but Backes was huge this afternoon. The U.S. power play was kind of interesting with Langenbrunner playing the point (as he does in New Jersey) with Rafalski, Brown, Kane and Parise (I think I got that first group right). They were running an umbrella so Langenbrunner wasn’t often actually on the point, but I’m curious how this look works against better teams with only one true defenceman. The other U.S. unit was more orthodox and scored the third goal thanks to a greasy Malone. The back end was pretty good, especially both Johnsons, but I thought Whitney was awful. He made a handful of mistakes which led to scoring chances and was torched by Sandy Jeannin early in the third. Gleason didn’t impress me a lot either. He was beaten on the give-and-go that led to the goal. Miller looked sharp with the goal being a big exception. It’s tough not getting many shots, but I thought he wasn’t fighting the puck and looked good in the little things. It was still a horrible goal to give up. Weber for the Swiss had a bad game getting beaten twice and man-handled physically by Backes on the second goal. As one of their few players with NHL experience and as Streit’s D partner he has to be better. I thought the Swiss used their four pairs too much and should have rolled the top pair and the Blindenbacher-Sbisa pair more too. Once the Swiss got a little momentum and confidence in the third I thought they looked not bad. They committed to the attack and pushed their defencemen more and really had the U.S. on their heels a little. Their old top line of Paterlini-Plüss-Rüthemann never really got going, but Domenichelli-Sannitz-Sprunger played well and Roman Wick had a good game too. Jeannin can be better. They may have a little more up front than I thought, but I'm not sure they're going to show it unless they're down and have to open it up. Canada 8 Norway 0 For a bit I thought Pal Grotnes had another 50 save effort against the Canadians in store. If Norway had left him in it would have been closer. Seriously, Bergeron? In two periods without him, Iginla goes from fourth to top line and scores three goals. How hard is this? Iginla-Nash-Crosby. Why did Bergeron make the team? I thought Crosby had an off-night and he still had three assists. Jesus. I know I pumped Shea Weber’s tires, but he wasn’t great. But Doughty was great. And watching Pronger reminds me of watching Ray Bourque (when he could be bothered to represent his country) - he may be an NHL superstar, but then you watch him internationally and realize that he's not very good at, you know, skating. Pronger was fine, but at times it looked like his skates were made of cement. The Shark line was good and so was Getzlaf-Perry-Staal. Trygg and Jakobsen were excellent on the Norway back end and they were missing their only NHLer in Tollefson due to a personal matter (?). Thoresen, Vikingstad and Aasen all played pretty well too. They were better than I expected. And credit to Norway for playing the piss out of Holos and Trygg. I don’t think anyone had more ice today and I think them playing four D really helped them keep it close for as long as they did. In the first they were able to make a clean breakout pass instead of straight up chipping and chasing. Canada wasn’t working hard enough or being physical enough and Norway was transitioning well. I was pleased Canada picked it up and made it harder on them in the second. I only half-saw the Russia-Latvia game at this point, so I’ll watch the tape later, but Russia looked pretty good. Though I think it needs to be Bryzgalov and not Nabokov. That first goal was pretty soft. Not sure if I’ll see many games live tomorrow, but I hope I can. Thanks for the kind words. One of the reasons I enjoyed doing it is because no one else does. I’ve done similar stuff for every tournament since 98. No one bothers to look at the smaller nations and no really worries about depth and line combinations on the bigger teams. cheers, hobbes |
| Saskatchewan for the CPL: multis e gentibus vires | |
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| Gunners | Feb 18 2010, 06:33 AM Post #37 |
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Hobbes, you're absolutely correct, and that's why I really have enjoyed your reviews. The major news sites focus entirely on the stars for the U.S. and Canadian teams, while even the hockey-specific sites focus primarily on the six favorites. It's tough to find good reviews of the Swiss, Norwegian, Latvian, Belarussian, German, and Slovakian teams, and its almost impossible to find thorough analysis of the lines and defensive pairings even for the favorites. Thanks again! No upsets thus far, but I suspect it's only a matter of time.... |
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| ursus arctos | Feb 18 2010, 07:33 AM Post #38 |
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Sweden were rather unimpressive against the Germans last night. They will lose to the Finns if they don't pick up their game considerably. |
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| hobbes | Feb 18 2010, 11:21 AM Post #39 |
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In the early game the Finns dealt with Belarus fairly easily, though I expected the Belorussians to be the team most succeptable to being blown out, so 5-1 isn't too bad. Teemu Selanne tied the Olympic point record with an early assist. The Swedes didn't really impress, but I give Germany a lot of credit. I didn't like the Swedish defence pairs much at all. Kronwall-Lidstrom is fine, but not who I would have paired and Enstrom-Ohlund isn't bad, but leads to problems: such as Oduya-Murray? How slow are those two? Pair them with someone with speed and then Tallinder a nice quiet steady guy who could pair nicely with a high end guy is with Johansson . . . Enstrom didn't have a good first game and Oduya and Murray were liabilities. They took too many penalties and were very lucky that the Germans didn't score on the 69-second five-on-three to open the second period. Hecht and Ehrohoff both struck iron and Hecht really should have finished. Oduya's idiotic checking from behind didn't cost them. The Germans were unlucky to go behind as Daniel Sedin's butt hit Greiss in the face on the power-play goal by Ohlund. The second goal was beautiful as Backstrom walked out and fed Eriksson with an unmissable chance. That play was started when Sulzer bailed out on contact and Alfredsson stole the puck. Sulzer made a few soft plays and it cost the Germans dearly. The Alfredsson-Backstrom-Eriksson line looked really good. The Gernan NHL line was playing well though they kept going offside. Tripp was a nice physical presence and Hospelt and Felski both had pretty good games. The Germans are deeper up front that I thought. And it was awesome to see Sven Butenschoen still playing with Germany and rocking a ridiculous beard. Surely he needs to get traded to the Grizzly Adams ASAP. The Czech-Slovakia game was the game of the tournament so far and looked like a classic for 30 minutes until the referees took over. A great tempo and intensity to the opening 30 with both goalies playing great. The crowd was fantastic and looked to be full of partisan fans. Then a bunch of ticky-tack penalties got called and the flow died for the rest of the second and then in the third the Czechs protected what they had and sat back being out-shot 12-2. Jagr has to be the MoTM, but Patrick Elias was the best player on the ice. He was dazzling. He and Plekanec played great together and they were so good you barely noticed that Marty Havlat was MIA. Jagr-Cervenka-Cajanek had some good chemistry too. Cervenka played really well and Cajanek nearly scored twice. The Czechs opened the scoring when a point shot hit Elias' behind. The Slovaks tied it early in the second on a great snipe by Gaborik who wasn't the feeling the affects of his injury at all. Marian Hossa was the best Slovak, but missed too many great chances. He hit the post and then seconds later got his pocket picked by Jagr who in two strides was suddenly on a partial breakaway which he didn't miss. Hossa wanted a hook and based on how tight they had been calling things it was a hook, but it was in that grey area between being strong, lifting the stick and winning a battle and obstruction. But in my mind if you aren't going to call a stick infraction that was leading to a breakaway, you can't call half of the penalties they called earlier in the period on play that were going to have no bearing on the game. Chara's second penalty of the period (probably deserved though the Czech dove a bit too) led to Jagr dominating down low and flipping the puck cross-crease to Plekanec who willed himself to one-hand the puck over the line in the crease. That kind of battle in close was something the Slovaks lacked a little and Plekanec's goal with two seconds left was a killer. Marian Hossa and Gaborik looked unstoppable together on the power play so they paired them for third and put them with Demitra and man they looked good. It made them a little top-heavy, but it was a good line. They each played 20 mins, which is a lot for forwards. I thought Richard Zednik had a lot of jump and played well. I liked what the Slovaks did with their defence: Chara-Meszaros and Strbak-Visnosky and then play the crap out of them. Jrcina and Sekera struggled together and for a guy like Jrcina that's there to be good down low and in his own end, he lost a lot of battles. They gave Chara superstar minutes (26:28 and he spent another four mins in the box) and he wasn't good enough on the day. They need him to be their best player, but I liked that they leaned on him. They have to because they don't have the depth on defence other teams do. They also shortened their bench to roll three lines. It was an interesting ploy given that they play tonight, but it also shows how much they wanted the win. It didn't hurt them on the night as they took it to the Czechs late and didn't appear to tire. The Cibak-Kopecky-Rodivojevic line on got spot duty and Baranka didn't play at all. Jagr was funny to me. He created and scored the winner and set up the back-breaker, but was kind of quiet. He reminded me of Carlos Valderrama towards the end of his career. You don't really notice him and then when he has the puck/ball he's lethal. Jagr did a great job of controlling the flow of the game and using his size to shield guys and create plays in the offensive zone. The comentators were going crazy with how 'great' he was. I thought he drifted in and out of the game and did little outside of the offensive zone, but he was smart about how he played. I didn't like the Czech's D pairings . . . they were very balanced and they rolled all four. Vokoun was sharp, but when Hossa and Gaborik got going the Czechs struggled to contain them — and they were already playing a defence-first disciplined style. What are the Russian's top two lines going to do to this group if they don't try to get a real shutdown pair together and work for the match-up. Polak-Kaberle isn't a bad pair. Too many good defensive defencemen with their two worst and their two offensive defencemen with two average defencemen. The Czechs defensive system play was good and they seemed on the same page pretty well on that front. That and Vokoun could make them tough if they get the lead. The Czechs will need to be better than 1-for-7 on the power play. I also thought Halak played pretty well. The Slovaks have Russia today and I'm really curious if they turn to Budaj to give Halak some rest. I don't think they're expecting to beat the Russians anyway and after an emotional letdown losing the derby with the Czechs, giving Budaj his chance may be what they need. There was a funny quote from US coach Ron Wilson complaining about the five Ryans on the team (not to mention Bobby Ryan): You say Ryan and three guys turn around. I need to learn the guys nicknames just to get my lines set. cheers, hobbes |
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| libero | Feb 18 2010, 07:28 PM Post #40 |
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I wonder if hobbes has stopped hyperventilating yet? Now that was exciting, Canada with a 3-2 shootout win over Switzerland. It was 2-2 after regualtion and the short OT, then on to the shootout where Canada's Martin Brodeur and Switzerland's Jonas Hiller each saved the first 3 and 4 attempts respectively. Then canada's Sidney Crosby scored on Canada's 4th attempt and Brodeur saved Switzerland's 5th attempt for the dramatic win. I did not know this but after the first 3 designated shooters, you can call in a repeat shooter and that is what happened with Crosby who scored on his 2nd bite of the cherry. Great excitement but the question which we don't yet know the answer to, was this just a blip or a sign of things to come for Canada? I join the chorus in praise off hobbes reports. Looking forward to what he has to say about this one. |
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| Yogi | Feb 19 2010, 10:17 AM Post #41 |
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That was some excitement. The Swiss goaltender played great all game and did well in the shootout too, only Brodeur was better. Helped having Crosby around too. Interesting to see the different rules in hockey from soccer on tie breaking shootouts. I think a lot of soccer teams would like to have their best penalty taker able to take another penalty after only 3 kickers. Canada-United States on Sunday should be a quite a game. |
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| hobbes | Feb 19 2010, 07:03 PM Post #42 |
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I was completely fine with last night’s Canada game. Everyone I talk to is really agitated and expect me to be as well, but I’m not. First, I’m not surprised and second, they didn’t play that badly. I think people fail to realize that it’s not 1936. If a team qualified for the Olympics (and yes they had to qualify, Norway had to win some games to get here) then they’re a good team. And if that good team has an NHL starting goalie then they can beat any team in the world on the day. The Canadians need to pick up the intensity and have a little more of a killer’s instinct, but I think some of that is chemistry and getting comfortable with their teammates. And this team doesn’t have the same kind of energy or grit that some of their opponents have shown. Any time Canada has done well they’ve had a hiccup or two. They have a huge game against the U.S. and that’s the practice exam. A win is huge (and all I want is top four, I don’t care how they do it. Style points are irrelevant and having a great prelim round is even more irrelevant) both in the standings and for confidence. Crosby needs to be better and I can’t repeat some of things people called him in the bar last night. I’m happy Iginla, Nash and Heatley are all going. Thornton and Marleau haven’t been bad either. Speaking of Nash, it was very professionally done, but I’m convinced he ran Jonas Hiller on purpose in OT. It’s possible it was an accident, but I have my doubts. I hate the shootout by the way. I wish it had stayed tied. The shootout format is the same at the world juniors, so everyone up here calls it that. The first time it was used it created some confusion, but worked out well as Jonathan Toews scored three goals out of five shots to beat the U.S. in the semis. It was interesting seeing who the Russians decided to throw out. All that fire power and Morozov? Really? Though I’ve followed the shootout enough over the years to know that it’s not always the obvious guy who has the best shootout move. That’s a huge win for the Slovaks. I thought they looked pretty spent, but Marian Hossa was great again. Once he scored (again five-hole, this time on Bryzgalov) the Slovaks had a lot more jump. I jumped the gun on saying Gaborik didn’t look that injured. He was really labouring out there. I don’t know what the Russians are doing. They’re not even close to fulfilling their promise. Where’s Datsyuk? Malkin? Asside from killing people with open ice hits, Ovechkin isn’t on top of his game either. The KHLers have been their best players. That result totally throws the group wide open. The Slovaks need to go deeper into their bench in their last game if they can. They should have earned themselves an easier second round match up and possibly a bye, but they need to have something in the tank for the quarters. There’s not much to say about Norway-US except that it was closer than it looked. I like the Norwegian line of Thoresen, Vikingstad and Zuckarello Aasen. Thoresen is the former NHLer, but the other have arguably been better over two games. I felt bad for Grotnes who was having a great game and his team let him down in the final few minutes. The U.S. team is playing well. They’re a fiesty young group and they’re playing loose and like they have nothing to lose. I’ve been impressed. cheers, hobbes |
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| ursus arctos | Feb 19 2010, 07:29 PM Post #43 |
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I agree on you on Nash. I'm not sure that he was intending to run Hiller from the very start of the play, but once he went realized that he was going down, it was pretty clear to me that he decided to make the most of it. |
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| Yogi | Feb 20 2010, 09:28 AM Post #44 |
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Here is an article previewing Sunday's 3 big matchups, each a big rivalry: http://sports.yahoo.com/olympics/news?slug...uters&type=lgns It is not an in depth hobbes like preview but gives some background to each game and what is an interesting tidbit is each of these games are repeats of the last 3 Olympic hockey finals: Russia-Czech Republic [1998], Canada-USA [2002] and Sweden-Finland [2006]. I also like the article comparing this to Argentina-Brazil, Spain-Italy and Germany-England, all being played on the same day in soccer's World Cup. Should be a great day for any hockey fan. |
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| hobbes | Feb 20 2010, 12:43 PM Post #45 |
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Wow I’ve become an adjective. ![]() I was really impressed with Finland last night. Their team speed completely overwhelmed Germany. Had Greiss started ahead of Patzold in the German goal it might have made a difference for awhile. Belarus put a nice scare into Sweden again and after the Czech blitzed the Latvians early (three goals in five minutes), the Latvians woke up and made the game interesting cutting the lead to 4-2. I’m curious if it’s a first round tactic to conserve energy or if it’s just their tactics, but the Czechs have been very negative after going ahead and have just tried to sit on their leads. I’m not sure the Czechs can sit on their heels like that in a quarterfinal. Selanne broke the record last night for career Olympic points. He had an assist for 37 points to pass Canada's Harry Watson, Czechoslovakia's Vlastimil Bubnik and Russia's Valeri Kharlamov. Incredibly Watson scored his 36 points back when they didn’t count assists and he did it in one Olympics — 1924 in Chamonix. He had 36 goals in five games. And people complain the Canadian women run up the score these days. Bubnik not only had a good hockey career, but he was part of Czechoslovakia’s bronze medal team from the 1960 Euro soccer championships. He scored three times in Euro 60. A few eastern bloc athletes played both soccer and hockey internationally in the late 50s and early 60s. And Kharlamov was one of the five best players I’ve ever seen. Bar none. It’s Selanne’s fifth Olympics which is amazing in itself. Yogi beat me to it. The last three finals all replayed on Super Sunday. It’s going to be great. All rivalry games to boot. Today’s pretty important as well as teams jockey for critical positions in the standings. cheers, hobbes |
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