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| 2010 World Cup Qualifying | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 9 2008, 05:12 AM (3,171 Views) | |
| Don Balon | Nov 16 2009, 10:17 PM Post #151 |
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This is a point to remember, it is difficult to score on Portugal and with Bosnia needing to score that could open themselves up to Portugal's counters. I thought Nani played well in the first game and I would think a counter attacking strategy would suit him well. But one unknown is the weather conditions, poor weather you would think would favour Bosnia. Maybe my mind has been poisoned by Spain's easy win in Bosnia but I think this Bosnian team is unbalanced and won't be able to keep portugal off the scoreboard. And recall one Portugal goal means Bosnia will need 3 to advance (2 -1 Bosnia sends Portugal through on away goals.) I am not sure why Joao Moutinho did not play, injured maybe? I'll have alook on some portuguese websites and see if I can find out. |
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| Mr. Pither | Nov 17 2009, 11:28 PM Post #152 |
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I was watching some of Carlos Queiroz' comments to the press and he was discussing that Portugal has played better away from home in qualifying. Not sure why, less pressure? More chance to counter attack than at home? For whatever reason that has been true. And there is some bad news for Bosnia as their playmaker Misimovic will miss the game through injury. |
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P-I-T-H-E-R ...as in Brotherhood, but with PI instead of the BRO and no HOOD | |
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| Dr. Z | Nov 17 2009, 11:58 PM Post #153 |
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There is probably a bit of both of the factors Mr Pither has described which explain why Portugal does better away from home. With their solid defense they're able to absorb the pressure the home team exerts and then use their counter attacking ability. But here is what I wonder, most of those away wins happened with Cristiano Ronaldo, an expert counter attacker, in the lineup. He won't be playing against Bosnia, so will that effect their ability on the break? |
| Poniendo el pecho a las balas! | |
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| Manzanares | Nov 18 2009, 12:27 AM Post #154 |
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I am not sure why Joao Moutinho did not play, injured maybe? I'll have alook on some portuguese websites and see if I can find out. Joao Moutinho is on the Portuguese roster for these games but is not starting. Haris Mendjunanin of Valladolid, a Dutch raised Bosnian who recently switched national team allegiances after representing Holland at the youth level, will replace the injured Misimovic. The field in Bosnia supposedly is not in good condition, that would seem to favor Bosnia's more direct approach. Look for an interesting battle between Dzeko against Pepe, Carvalho and Bruno Alves. |
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| shelsoccer | Nov 18 2009, 08:07 AM Post #155 |
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I have nothing against Portugal -- in fact, it's one of my favorite countries I've visited -- but I'll be pulling for Bosnia. With all that nation has had to endure, a World Cup berth would lift national spirits enormously. Think of Honduras times ten. I'm sure the crowd will be highly energized. Enough to pull the upset? We'll see in a matter of hours. |
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| raconteur | Nov 18 2009, 03:19 PM Post #156 |
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Wednesday's European playoff results: Ukraine 0-1 Greece (Greece qualify 1-0) Slovenia 1-0 Russia (Slovenia qualify on away goals after 2-2 aggregate score) Bosnia 0-1 Portugal (Portugal qualify 2-0) France 1-1 Ireland (aet) (France qualify 2-1 on aggregate) Russia are out as they lost to a 44th minute Slovenian goal as Dedic stuck out a leg and stabbed in a free kick. Midway through the 2nd half Russia's forward Kerzakhov was sent off for kicking the goalie afetr a scramble for the ball and lo and behold Guus Hiddink's qualifying magic ran out! Greece got agoal after a half hour to win in Ukraine. Good win for Greece who stifled Ukraine's attacks, although Shevchenko ahd 2 goos opportunities before Greece scored. Raul Meirelles with Portugal's goal as they won in Bosnia, Nani and Simao set him up. Then on to the truly dramatic game of the day. Ireland outplayed a nervous looking France over 90 minutes and led at the half 1-0 after Duff nicely cut the ball back to Robbie Keane to score from near the penalty spot. Try as they could Ireland could not get a 2nd while France were shooting blanks. On to extra time where France suddenly became lively, they had the ball in the net, but it was correctly overturned for offside, then Anelka looked to be brought down for a penalty by Shay Given, but nothing called. Finally a free kick to the far post was handled by Thierry Henry who then flicked it to William Gallas to head in the net. Ireland huffed and puffed after that but didn't have enough energy remaining and went out with the 1-1 tie giving France a 2-1 victory over both legs. I'm thinking of Trappattoni who was victimized as Italy coach by home town calls against Korea at World Cup 2002 now lightning strikes twice against a Trap coached team as France eliminated Ireland with a handled goal. |
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| Simon | Nov 18 2009, 03:43 PM Post #157 |
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Got to feel sorry for Ireland. I feel they deserved to go to the World Cup. When I say that, I don't so much mean instead of Italy or France, but just in more general terms I think the tournament would have been enriched by the presence of their team and certainly their fans. But there's only room for 32 teams, so there it is. The question now after this scrape is whether Domenech can shape France into a team that is equal to the sum of its parts, because there's little doubt they have the talent to be among the contenders at South Africa 2010. If one of the favoured teams in these play-offs had to slip up, my money would probably have been on the Russians. Hobbes called it correctly earlier in the thread as well. They're capable of playing some really good stuff, but too often they can be just terrible. The contrast in their performance against Holland and their car crash of a showing against Spain in the Euros is the extreme example, but that kind of unpredictability has come to define this team. Ultimately, the old maxim is true, that the success of a team is defined by what they can do on their bad days. Anyone can win on a good day, but Hiddink for all his talent as a coach never managed to make Russia consistent or resilient. Credit to Slovenia though, that's now two World Cups and a European Championships in the space of ten years. I increasingly wonder how the old Yugoslavia never won anything! |
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| Merengue | Nov 18 2009, 04:06 PM Post #158 |
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Yes that was just awful luck for Ireland. Maybe Anelka was pulled down for a Pk but none was given but to go out of the World Cup on a goal following a hand ball is just rotten luck. All the more so when Ireland played so well during the 90 minutes of this second leg. I guess it is the pressure at home which got to both Ireland and France for the games they hosted because both were outplayed by the visitors. I am curious to see what Ireland will do with Trappatoni? He's done a pretty good job rebuilding them following the train wreck that was the Steve Staunton coached era there, but will this failure to qualify lead the FAI to part ways with Trappatoni? As for France, well we keep burying Domenech but he stays alive. I'm thinking he keeps the job through South Africa even if everybody knows that is not the ideal move for France. Portugal were exactly as described here, tenacious and very hard to break down, they created the best chances throughout against Bosnia and were rewarded with that goal which meant Bosnia needed 3 more to qualify. In the end though they didn't get any. So you had two competing forces meeting, Russia's inherent inconsistency versus Hiddink's qualifying magic, and Russia's inconsistency won out! Slovenia really have done well for such a small nation, and all the more so when practically all of their team play for modest clubs. |
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| Don Balon | Nov 18 2009, 09:59 PM Post #159 |
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Portugal were rarely troubled by Bosnia despite their noisy home support. Says a lot about Portugal's disciplined defending which sucked the life out of Bosnia. I did not think it was true but Queiroz has converted pepe into a defensive midfielder, he often drops back to play like a 3rd centerback but he does play slightly in front of Bruno Alves and Ricardo Carvalho. An interesting twist meant to get each of Portugal's talented central defenders on the field at once. I know Russia sometimes has slip ups but not usually against lessser teams like Slovenia. With all respect to them, it is one thing for Russia to lose to Spain or Germany, another to do so against Slovenia. But 2 red cards also showed the nerves the Russians had. I wonder if some other qualified nation will look to contract Hiddink? I do not know how long is his contract with Russia and until last night I am sure they were thrilled with him, but national team coaching in particular is a what have you done for me lately occupation. Everybody feels for Ireland who went to Paris and for 90 minutes had France reeling. But not putting away more than one goal and some tired legs hurt them as the French did control the extra time. I thought that probably was a penalty against Anelka too (for me France's best player next to goalie Lloris) but even with that the law of recompensation was cruel to the Irish with that goal scored after Henry's handball. A tough way to lose out on the Mundial. |
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| Yogi | Nov 18 2009, 10:51 PM Post #160 |
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As long as Domenech is still in charge of France, don't worry about them creating an impact in South Africa. Domenech won't have Zidane around to rescue him anymore! Terrible luck for the Irish (dispelling the beneficial notions of the luck of the Irish!) who worked their socks off in outplaying France ove r90 minutes. In both games Gourcuff was AWOL and with Ribery out that meant France were always struggling to create chances. Gignac came in with some good press but he looked like a stiff to me, amazing that Domenech did not call on Benzema. I had never heard of Andrews before these games but on Wednesday he was so active in midfield, a very good display from him. I'm not sur ehow the linesman could have missed henry's handball on that French goal but he did and Ireland goes out under the cruelest of circumstances. Like the old ABC Wide World of Sports motto, "The thrill of victory and the agony of defeat." Wednesday was Ireland's agony. Shevchenko twice had Ukraine's fate on his feet but both times he missed his chances. And so went Ukraine's World Cup hopes. |
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| Sporting | Nov 19 2009, 03:01 AM Post #161 |
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Henry's been a great player and always came across as a decent person, but that handball will be very hard for people to forget. He has admitted it (how could he do otherwise?) but even though it's very rare for a player to ask the referee to intervene at the time something like this happens, there will be those for whom Henry will be forever associated with cheating. As said above, however, the Irish had chances to kill off the game beforehand, and will be kicking themselves today, as long as their tears allow them enough energy to do so! |
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| raconteur | Nov 19 2009, 08:19 AM Post #162 |
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The Irish FA is calling for the match to be replayed even if their own coach admits that is an impossibility: http://sports.yahoo.com/soccer/news?slug=r...uters&type=lgns The blatantly incorrect decision by the referee to award the goal has damaged the integrity of the sport and we now call on FIFA, as the world governing body for our sport, to organise for this match to be replayed,” read an FAI statement. “The hand-ball was recognised (by) the FIFA commissioner, the referee observer and the match officials as well as by the player himself.” The FAI issued the statement as Ireland manager Giovanni Trapattoni was telling a news conference it would be impossible to replay the match. “I cannot ask this because I know it is impossible,” said Trapattoni after his team had gone out 2-1 on aggregate. “When a referee decides, it ends the game for me”. You can understand Ireland's frustration at losing out like this but as we have all said they also wasted plenty of opportunities and there is very little mention in articles I have read about the obvious penalty to Anelka which was not given. Only on this message board am I reading that being brought up as mitigating Ireland's poor fortune. I am an Italy fan so I naturally have antipathy towards France but I don't see the great injustice here nor do I see Henry being a "cheat" for handling the ball. He was trying to control a quickly moving ball in front of him and leaned towards it, when you do that your hand likely will be in front of you, not at your side, and the ball hit his hand. Should the goal have been called back? Yes but if the ref correctly gives Anelka the penalty then this all does not matter. Some here were not surprised by Russia falling in Slovenia but i certainly was shocked by that. I really thought Hiddink's Russia was better than that. I usually don't care for goal.com articles but here is one I found which is kind of interesting and talks about Russia's defensive problems, notably their slow central defenders: http://sports.yahoo.com/soccer/news?slug=g...=goal&type=lgns That may be true but they still only gave up 2 goals in the 2 matches. Their problem was they only scored twice themselves. In the end the slumping Pavlyuchenko, Pogbrenyak and Kerzakhov could not get the job done for them offensively. |
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| Simon | Nov 19 2009, 09:23 AM Post #163 |
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I agree with most of raconteur's post but I can't really go with this bit. For me, that's a really charitable description of the incident. I've seen it plenty of times now and I think it's a monstrous example of cheating. He deliberately moved his hand to the ball and cupped it back into play. He practically caught it! He knew what he was doing and I think Sporting is right to say that this incident will always provide a 'yes, but' which will be attached to Henry's name and reputation forever, a bit like with Rivaldo - great player but that outrageous cheating against Turkey in 2002 always swims into mind when you think of him. I don't know if you've seen this, but there have been plenty of showings of footage showing Henry and Richard Dunne sitting next to each other on the pitch after the game. Henry can clearly be seen saying "I cheated", and Dunne pats him on the arm as if to say 'thanks for admitting it'. But that's not quite the line he's come out with when talking to the media. I agree with Sporting that it would take a saint to try and convince the ref to disallow the goal, though that sort of thing wasn't too uncommon in sport until relatively recently (and perhaps such attitudes still persist in golf and cricket?) but still, for Henry to race off ecstatically celebrating the goal is bound to stick in peoples throats as well. Of course replaying the match is impossible, and to think all this follows from the Irish already being annoyed at the senselessly late decision to seed the play-offs. As Yogi says, so much for the luck of the Irish! As for Trapattoni, I think the FAI have already agreed a contract extension with him. |
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| valenciano | Nov 19 2009, 09:33 AM Post #164 |
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So Slovenia became the only one of the non seeded playoff teams to advance. I am like raconteur in being surprised that they did so. Before these playoffs began I viewed them as the weakest of the 8 teams but that may have been due to my general ignorance about Slovenia's team and players. But they proved you win games not with names but with team play and that they had against Russia. Did you see those pictures of Guus Hiddink on the sidelines during the match? Did he ever look sour! I think France won a lot of friends with the way they played in winning World Cup 98 and Euro 2000 but much of what they've done since then has turned people off on them and this Henry handball will certainly add to that. Maybe this incident though will help calls for using replays gain more credibility. Now I know you can't be using replays in a Bosnian 2nd division game or the Mozambique 1st division due to the cost and logistics of it all but in the modern game in major competitions I do not see anything wrong with using a video replay to get the call right, whether it is determining if a shot crossed the goal line or if a ball was handled on the way towards goal, then use the replay. It won't injure the game and still allows the referee to make the calls but when somrthing can mean the difference between winning and losing in a World Cup or a Champions League match, why not use a replay? |
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| Simon | Nov 19 2009, 10:15 AM Post #165 |
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Actually, valenciano widening the debate reminds me of a good point I heard on the tv this morning. In the Europa League this season, UEFA are experimenting with having extra 'goal-line officials' placed behind each goal. Last night's incident adds credibility to that experiment IMO, as surely the extra official could have spotted the handball? The extra officials have worked pretty well in the Europa League and I think it's a decent compromise in the short to medium-term, as surely Bosnia, Mozambique etc would be able to plonk a couple of extra officials at either end? FIFA insists that if video replays / 'smart balls' etc can't be used in places like Mozambique then they shouldn't be used anywhere. I've always felt that argument to be ridiculous. Most regional tennis courts or cricket grounds won't have expensive Hawkeye technology, but that's not to say it shouldn't be used at Wimbledon or Lord's! I'm with valenciano that such technology should be in use at the very least in World Cup or CL matches. I reckon that in years to come such technology will be used without problems in football, and people will look back and marvel at how long it took to introduce it. |
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