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| Champions League | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 1 2008, 07:30 AM (4,224 Views) | |
| Martin | May 27 2009, 10:39 PM Post #331 |
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I do not know what to add about the play of both Xavi and Iniesta which has not yet been written here. They rarely misplay a pass, make a wonderful midfield partnership and make all those around them better. Puyol was his tough as nails best in defense while Pique looks like Spain's centerback for the next 10 years. It makes you wonder how Manchester United let him go. But rosarino is right, it was an all around team effort from Barcelona. In a way this reminded me of Milan v Barcelona in 1994 when Milan then, like Barcelona now, were missing some starting defenders and thus were viewed as an underdog against their noted opponents. But as in 1994 the team missing some defenders went out and dominated the game.
Good question raconteur, you have got those four right, the other two are Giovanni Trapattoni who won it as a player with Milan and as a coach with Juventus and Frank Rijkaard who won as a player with both Milan and Ajax and as a coach with Barcelona. |
| Club Sportivo Desamparados | |
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| dafyd | May 28 2009, 03:57 AM Post #332 |
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As Martin says, there isn't much to add that hasn't been said. Still, I watched the game last night, having taped it, and will probably do so again over the weekend. Still, here's my two cents worth: Thank God Barca won. I don't think it was so much that Manchester played poorly, at least at first, but that they ran into a brick wall that was the Barcelona defense. Early on they had their chances, but Puyol & company did not crack under the pressure, and instead it was United that simply seemed to lose their nerve. I do have to agree with raconteur on the Rooney/Park on the wings, Ronaldo as a forward. I know I don't see as much of him as others here, but what I have seen of Ronaldo screams best winger in the game to day, perhaps the best I've ever seen. Still, I'm a sucker for the underdog, and, with everything I'd heard before this game, MU were the favored team going in. It still seems odd to me to consider Barca the underdog, considering that they had already bagged two titles this season, and with this one became the first team from Spain to win the three biggest trophies for the year. Take that, Real Madrid! |
| Leper In A Stange Land | |
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| historyman | May 28 2009, 05:31 AM Post #333 |
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Well, the match never did boil down to a 'Ronaldo v Messi' contest, but it was clear who delivered on the biggest stage of all. Superb header from Messi, not just in the way that he leaped but also the way that he powered the header across Van der Sar and into the far corner. Thought it was wonderful not to have any controversy in last night's final. No ifs, no buts, simply the best team winning and everybody accepting that. |
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| Mr. Pither | May 28 2009, 08:07 AM Post #334 |
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Well done to Barcelona for an excellent game. All this pregame talk of how their already vulnerable defense would be in even worse shape because of injuries/suspensions was rubbished by what took place. The defense was excellent, after the initial United flurry in the first 9 minutes and the nice save when Valdes was quick off his line to snuff out Ronaldo's shot on goal just after Barcelona made it 2-0, Manchester United did not trouble Barcelona defensively. I was going to remark how flat Manchester United looked last night and quip that they played as if they spent the night before out on the town with Simon and his mates but teams that play flat usually are flat from the opening whistle. That was not the case last night, United began well and put pressure on Barcelona until Eto'o scored the goal on Barcelona's first attack, after that it was all downhill for United as Barcelona's passing game took over. There are few club teams that I can recall recently who have had two midfielders as good on the ball as Xavi and Iniesta. I think you have to go back to national teams like France and Brazil in the 80's when they had Platini/Giresse and Zico/Socrates. Oh, and Spain's current team with two guys named Xavi and Iniesta! It is a real pleasure watching a team pass the ball like Barcelona do. As another poster noted, what does Pep Guardiola do now for an encore? |
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P-I-T-H-E-R ...as in Brotherhood, but with PI instead of the BRO and no HOOD | |
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| CelesteBlanca10 | May 28 2009, 08:09 AM Post #335 |
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I totally agree with historyman - well said. I must admit i'm a bit surprised by the lineup Fergusson started with. My thoughts on Tevez are very well known (at least to the fellow Argentinians that post on the Argentinean threads here), and I have no doubt that if he would start with him instead of Park the story would've been different. I'm sure Guardiola thanks him for that - or at least Puyol and Pique for sure. But the fact that he threw in both Tevez and Berbatov together at the end was both sad (tried whatever he could to turn things around) and useless (too many forwards, too much confusion up front). But all said, and forgive me Carlitos, I'm super happy Barca won last night!!! The deserve it. And Leo, about that header .. well, no words :-) |
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| Merengue | May 28 2009, 08:30 AM Post #336 |
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Congratulations to Dr. Z and the other Barcelona fans here on a job well done. I admit I was surprised at the outcome, not so much that Barcelona won but by the ease in which they did so. I agree with those posters noting how United look disjointed. They seemed to build their game on neutralizing Messi and Henry on the wings but had no reply to Barcelona switching Messi and Eto'o around or of course to the midfield promptings of Xavi and Iniesta. Then in the second half I do not blame them for putting more forwards on to look for a goal but the team became even more disjointed. I know some United fans may lament about the suspension of Darren Fletcher but come on losing a complimentary player on your team, especially one with Manchester United's depth is something which should be overcome. Eto'o, like Torres did earlier in the season, made Vidic look ordinary with his speed and quick turns. Barcelona simply made Manchester United chase the ball as Barca's passing game kicked into gear. To be honest this match reminded me of many of the recent Spain vs England national team matches I have seen. A team which knows how to intelligently use the ball can cause nightmares for it's opponent. The redeeming part of this Barcelona victory for me was that Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol and Pique are all mainstays for Spain. |
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| Dr. Z | May 28 2009, 09:51 AM Post #337 |
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I am thrilled with yesterday's win. So much for the talk about how Barcelona lack a plan B, when you pass and move like they do that seems to me to imply by it's very nature that there are alternatives there. To not only win the Champions League but do it with 3 starting defenders out and two other players not fully fit and by controlling play against a team of Manchester United's quality says a lot about the quality in this Barcelona team. By putting 10 men behind the ball Chelsea were the one team who shut Barcelona down this season in a big game, but Manchester United were not the only big club who were overwhelmed by Barcelona this season, ask Real Madrid, Lyon and Bayern Munich! Yes it is hard to top this season for Guardiola and Barcelona as they won every competition they were entered in but next season I would look for Barcelona to try and increase their depth. Also look for a club who stress it's youth team to continue to integrate more players from it's youth system. |
| Poniendo el pecho a las balas! | |
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| Pepe | May 28 2009, 11:58 AM Post #338 |
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Merengue wrote,
Absolutely! That will make it easier to take all the gloating coming out of Barcelona for the next year!
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| Yogi | May 28 2009, 03:22 PM Post #339 |
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While the Manchester United and apparently Real Madrid fans are not happy with the result, I believe most everyone else is because this Barcelona team plays football which is enjoyable to watch and last night they put on a good show. They really did have Manchester United chasing shadows for a good portion of the game. Chelsea were able to use their physicality to make Barcelona uncomfortable but Man United never were able to do that. In part I think because of the positional switches which others have noted but also because Barcelona I think learned from the Chelsea game and moved the ball quicker yesterday than they did in the two legs of the semifinal. As Dr Z is proud to point out Barcelona demolished a lot of pretty good teams this season and now have this historic triple of titles won. There is a lot to like about this Barcelona team, unless your own team is playing them! |
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| libero | May 28 2009, 04:13 PM Post #340 |
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What I find enlightening in an era when commentators often claim that the sport is becoming more and more athletic and less technical, Barcelona won the Champions League with it's 3 chief creative players all under 5'7" (Messi, Xavi and Iniesta). The same applied with last summer's win by Spain in the Euro Cup. So is this a coming trend of placing more emphasis on technical players or just because this is an extraordinary group of talented players with ties to both Barcelona and Spain who are bucking the trend against big, strong players? I think this game also showed the importance of an early goal to a match's outcome. If Barcelona does not get that 10th minute goal, would the game have changed much? Although Manchester United began the game on the attack, after the goal they were on their back foot for most of the rest of the game. It is great to have versatile players but the more I think about it maybe those complaining about Rooney's positioning are correct. The guy has a strong shot with either foot, is a pretty good passer and works well behind a center forward. Sure his effort enables him to play on the wing too but that is not in my opinion making best use of his skills. Too often Ronaldo was all alone up front for Manchester United because Rooney and even Tevez when he came on were playing too deep. They each need to be closer to goal. A race horse could be used to plow a field but is that really making the best use of it's ability? |
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| Johnbuildr | May 29 2009, 04:37 AM Post #341 |
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<<I think this game also showed the importance of an early goal to a match's outcome. If Barcelona does not get that 10th minute goal, would the game have changed much? Although Manchester United began the game on the attack, after the goal they were on their back foot for most of the rest of the game. >> That is a very astute and interesting observation, Libero. I am late posting and won't try to add to the excellent analysis here, other than to say that as a fan with no horse in the race, I thought it was a very good game with an interesting phsychological flow, which Libero nailed spot on. Undeniable that the best team won. The pre game talking heads almost guaranteed the match to ManU, which kind of mystified me given Barca's season. Then ManU came out and for all the world looked unstoppable and like they would steam roll their way to victory. I was thinking, well, maybe the commentators were all right. Then, Barca scores on their first real run, a counter in which you do not often see a world class back, who was in good position by the way, get beaten so badly, and it was suddenly a different game for almost the entire rest of the match. I don't know for sure, but there was certianly something about that early goal that pyschologically, and in reality, completely turned the match around. |
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Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum | |
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| Merengue | May 29 2009, 10:20 AM Post #342 |
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I got the impression that Manchester United came out with the intent to look for the early goal and while they put Barcelona under that early pressure, once Barca went down the other end and scored it was as if United did not know how to react. And once Barcelona kicked in with their passing game United were caught chasing the ball and were unable to effectively counter attack because as others noted Cristiano Ronaldo was isolated up top. And yes as Martin and manzanares can tell you the fact Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Pique and Busquets are all Spanish internationals was what encouraged me while watching Barcelona win this title. We knew about Xavi, Iniesta and Puyol of course but this season has also seen the 22 year old Pique and the 20 year old Busquets establish themselves as stars in the making. And while we are on trivia questions, here is one for you all, Sergi Busquets father was the backup goalie, and Guardiola's teammate when Barcelona won the European title in 1992. Are there any other father-son combinations who have won European championship? Jose Reina won it with Liverpool but his father Miguel, also a goalkeeper was only a runner up with Atletico Madrid. I'm thinking perhaps Cesare and Paolo Maldini with Milan? |
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| Yogi | May 29 2009, 02:37 PM Post #343 |
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Yes you are correct Merengue, both Cesare and Paolo Maldini won the Champions Cup/League with Milan. If it is true that emulation is the best form of flattery, I wonder if we will see more clubs try and emulate Barcelona's passing style? This style worked last summer for Spain and now it has done the same for Barcelona. Of course you need the technically gifted players they have for it to be successful but I would hope more clubs will try and go out and use this style of play. Arsenal and Roma already do, maybe more will follow? |
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| valenciano | May 30 2009, 08:05 AM Post #344 |
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Well that is the key isn't it Yogi? Most clubs do not have the players who can make them play as Barcelona do. But it isn't just technical skill, it also has to do with the club's mentality. In Spain there are plenty of teams who do play a passing game, it just is that few are ableto do it as well as barca do. As for Wednesday's Final, what can you add about how Barcelona played? I do think they learned from the Chelsea games and moved the ball quicker. Busquets I think deserves some praise too for he kept things simple at defensive midfield. Quickly distributing it to Xavi, Iniesta and the overlapping fullbacks. He's only 20 but he is quite mature for such a young player. And Pique has become a very good centerback, Ronaldo got that yellow card early in the game on Pique when the ball took a bad bounce off him but overall he stopped Manchester United's attackers from running at him and controlled everything in the air. Pregame somebody here mentioned how well he has played and how that has helped Barcelona defend against teams who are overall taller than they and Pique's play in this final made those comments look spot on. |
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| hobbes | May 30 2009, 08:57 AM Post #345 |
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And as much as wish all teams would try to play the "right" way, if I didn't have the skill in my squad I'd do what most managers do. Looking at the EPL this year, I gave West Brom a ton of credit for trying to take teams on and play an attractive style . . . and they finished bottom of the table. While the likes of Bolton ground out results and stayed up. I hope more quality sides try to commit to attack and play the ball on the ground as Spain and Barça do, but I think the number of teams that can actually attain it is pretty small. cheers, hobbes |
| Saskatchewan for the CPL: multis e gentibus vires | |
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