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"INSIDE" - adj, adv, noun, prep; INTESTINES
Topic Started: Apr 4 2014, 06:14 AM (804 Views)
steeven
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INSIDE
inside (adj) ----- vnutreny
inside (adv) ----- vnutri
inside (nf) ------- vnutrenost'
inside (prep) ---- vevnutri (+gen)

Comments?




Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
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bandziol20
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I propose :
vnutrny (adj.) ~ cz vnitřní, sk vnútorný
vnutri (adv. / prep. + Gen.) (location) ~ sk vnútri, ru внутри
dovnutra (adv. / prep. + Gen.) (goal) ~ sk dovnútra
vnutrnost' (f.), vnutriny (plur.) 'insides, bowels'
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
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steeven
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I like it.
But why "do" for preposition and not "v"?
Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
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bandziol20
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I don't know. For me it's more clear morphologically than ~ v?v-nutr and semantically ("do" usually means 'to' for an exact endpoint)
In this respect I propose to include a noun vnutro (sk vnútro, usb nutro, pl wnętrze) as 'interior, centre, inners', and so do-vnutra could be read literally 'to the centre (of sth)'.

Another proposition is to resign of do- and use (for goal of motion - where to ?) only vnutr (ru внутрь).

BTW, what about : 'from the inside' ? I mean for example how to say : The door was locked from the inside. ?
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
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iopq
Administrator
iz vnutri
Bo v c'omu žytti pomiž baletom i svobodoju zavždy potribno vybyraty svobodu, navit' jakščo ce čehoslovac'kyj general.
Sergij Žadan "Anarchy in the Ukr"
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IJzeren Jan
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Jan van Steenbergen
bandziol20
May 9 2014, 12:49 PM
I propose :
vnutrny (adj.) ~ cz vnitřní, sk vnútorný
vnutri (adv. / prep. + Gen.) (location) ~ sk vnútri, ru внутри
dovnutra (adv. / prep. + Gen.) (goal) ~ sk dovnútra
vnutrnost' (f.), vnutriny (plur.) 'insides, bowels'
I agree with those.

IMO dovnutra and vovnutri are both equally okay. The former is more West Slavic, the latter more East/Ѕouth Slavic.

As a synonym for vnutrny we could also have vnutrišnji (Ukrainian, South Slavic).
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
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steeven
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IJzeren Jan
May 10 2014, 04:48 PM
As a synonym for vnutrny we could also have vnutrišnji (Ukrainian, South Slavic).
Why vnutrišnji?
and not vnutrišny (to conform with Interslavic and NOT natural langs) :o :blink:
Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
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IJzeren Jan
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Jan van Steenbergen
It's just that practically all Slavic languages using this affex have a soft adjective here. Similar cases are dnešnji, (j)utrišnji, včerašnji etc. That's not contrary to Interslavic, Interslavic has soft adjectives, too.

[čćч]
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
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bandziol20
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IJzeren Jan
May 10 2014, 04:48 PM
IMO dovnutra and vovnutri are both equally okay. The former is more West Slavic, the latter more East/Ѕouth Slavic.
Where have you found vovnutri in East/South Slavic ? It seems to me quite unbelievable.
BTW, in the Dict :
Quote:
 
inside adv. vnųtri · внутри
inside prep. + gen. vnųtr · внутр
I recommend to use both as well as an adverb and as an preposition. :)

FROM THE INSIDE
usb = wotnutřka
cz = zevnitř
sk = znútra, zvnútra
sn = od znotraj
hr = iznutra
bg = отвътре*
ru = изнутри
*as I think ъ stands here for PS. nasal *ǫ (comp. bg мъж < PS. mǫž 'man').

Well, I've thought about od-vnutra 'from the inside' as a kind of analogy to do-vnutra 'to the inside' ?
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
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iopq
Administrator
there's вовнутрь in Ru, "to the inside"
Bo v c'omu žytti pomiž baletom i svobodoju zavždy potribno vybyraty svobodu, navit' jakščo ce čehoslovac'kyj general.
Sergij Žadan "Anarchy in the Ukr"
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yelena
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Croatian: iznutra, unutra, unutrašnjost
Naco je chudobný clovek? Naco je svet, ci len aby bieda bola?
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bandziol20
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Check out 'intestines' in the Dynamic Dictionary : vųtrĺby ? I think it's a hyper-flavourization, it should be v-utrOby (suffix -oba, hr utroba)
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
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IJzeren Jan
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Jan van Steenbergen
Yeah, you're right. It should be vųtroby. I'll update the dictionary. Thanks for noticing!
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
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steeven
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INTESTINES vs BOWELS, ENTRAILS
I thought I had posted this comparison of word-forms among our languages yesterday/earlier today. Apparently not. So here it is:
Intestines
ru = кишечник
be = кішачнік
uk = кишечник
pl = jelit
cs = střeva
sk = čreva
sl = črevesje
hr = crijeva
sr = црева
mk = цревата
bg = черва
Bowels/Entrails
ru = внутренности
be = вантробы
uk = нутрощі
pl = wnętrzności, trzewia
cs = vnitřnosti
sk = vnútornosti
sl = drobovje
hr = iznutrice, utroba
sr = изнутрице
mk = цревата
bg = вътрешности
Edited by steeven, Oct 1 2014, 07:49 PM.
Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
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steeven
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vųtroby
Given the translations shown above, what is the reason for using vųtroby as the MS translation for the English word "intestines"?
(only BE & HR appear to have a word-form even close to this)
Polish has the word: wątroba - which translate to the English word "liver". It would seem vųtroby could be misinterpreted by Polish speakers, no?
:huh:
NOTE: We found that "LIVER" was a challenging word to translate into Interslavic. I preserved our discussions about "LIVER" HERE
From SLOVA #11-Post #86 - October 5, 2011:
Selecting a word that will be most universally understood by all Slavic speakers.
Sometimes it is easy: "was" = "byl"
Sometimes it is challenging: "liver" -
ru = печень
uk = печінка
be = печань
pl = wątroba
cs = játra
sk = pečeň
csb = wątroba
dsb = jatra
hsb = jětša
sl = jetra
bo = јетра
hr = jetra
sr = јетра
mk = дроб
bg = дроб


Interslavic Lexicon:
Level 1 = "hepa" > universal
Level 2 = "jetra" - cs hr sr
Level 2 = "pečen" - bu ru sk uk
Level 2 = "vutroba" - pl

Edited by steeven, Oct 2 2014, 06:59 AM.
Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
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