Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Dobrodošli na forum Medžuslovjanskogo jezyka! Želajemo vam mnogo prijemnosti.
Добродошли на форум Меджусловјанского језыка! Желајемо вам много пријемности.
Welcome to Interslavic! We hope you enjoy your visit.

Sejčas pogledajete naše forum kako gosť. To znači, že imajete ograničeny dostup do někojih česti forum i ne možete koristati vse funkcije. Ako li pristupite v našu grupu, budete imati svobodny dostup do sekcij preznačenyh jedino za členov, na pr. založeňje profila, izsylaňje privatnyh poslaň i učestničstvo v glasovaňjah. Zapisaňje se jest prosto, bystro i vpolno bezplatno.

Сејчас погледајете наше форум како гость. То значи, же имајете ограничены доступ до некојих чести форум и не можете користати все функције. Ако ли приступите в нашу групу, будете имати свободны доступ до секциј презначеных једино за членов, на пр. заложеньје профила, изсыланьје приватных послань и учестничство в гласованьјах. Записаньје се јест просто, быстро и вполно безплатно.

You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.

Pristupite v našu grupu! Приступите в нашу групу! Join our community!
Ako li už jeste člen, prijavite se, že byste mogli koristati vse možnosti:
Ако ли уж јесте член, пријавите се, же бысте могли користати все можности:
If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Assimilation by softness
Topic Started: Jun 3 2012, 08:39 AM (1,410 Views)
iopq
Administrator
the real question is whether we want to have archaic forms of od- or not
because od- everywhere seems simpler

hell, ot- everywhere seems even better since it's consistent with otrubi/otvoriti
Bo v c'omu žytti pomiž baletom i svobodoju zavždy potribno vybyraty svobodu, navit' jakščo ce čehoslovac'kyj general.
Sergij Žadan "Anarchy in the Ukr"
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
tellur
Member Avatar

bandziol20
Jun 11 2012, 07:53 AM
I think it would be better avoid this ř and replace it by rj, since not many people has this font (unless you're Czech). In this situation could appear differences between the text with Latin and the text with Cyrillic letters (with soft yer font).
BTW, I would have nothing against writing otvoreny (with lack of haczek) if we decided that r was dispalatalized first. Otherwise it would seem to be inconsistent for other consonants like m, n, l which get -jen for a passive participle. :P

EDIT : By the way I think : s / z + -jen should give = šen / žen.
Not many people know this but on most of the Slavic keyboard layouts, you can create ď, ť, ň, ľ, ř, ě, ž, š, č with relative ease. I have just tested it.
The caron is located on the key assigned to number 2. All you have to do is to press this key while holding AltGr, then the letter you want and voila. You got ě or ř ;)
http://www.terena.org/activities/multiling/ml-mua/test/kbd-all.html#Polish
Edited by tellur, Jun 11 2012, 12:18 PM.
My Interslavic shortly - no i/y disinction and o/e rule enforced (byti>biti x biti>biti, svežego x dobrogo), soft consonants ń, ĺ, ď, ť, ŕ, ě/e merged, ę->ja, no syllabic r/l (torg, deržava, volk, dolgi), tl/dl clusters preserved (midlo, metla), CroC, CloC, CreC, CleC (grod, glova, breg, mleko), 1st sg. ending -u, 3rd pl. ending ut/jat (delaju, čuju, molvju x delajut, čujut, molvjat). Basically, a heavy Western flavour with some Eastern elements.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
IJzeren Jan
Member Avatar
Jan van Steenbergen
iopq
Jun 11 2012, 11:31 AM
hell, ot- everywhere seems even better since it's consistent with otrubi/otvoriti
od UK, BE, RUE, PL, CSB, CZ, SK, SL, SH, MK = 4,5 votes
ot RU, DSB, HSB, BG = 1,5 votes

For the rest I don't see any possible advantage in using ot. Doesn't seem to solve any significant problem.
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
tellur
Member Avatar

iopq
Jun 11 2012, 11:31 AM
hell, ot- everywhere seems even better since it's consistent with otrubi/otvoriti
I also agree that it's better. Personally, I love ot as a prefix and as a preposition!
However, as JvS said, the majority of languages use od so I guess od is better.
But I also think that ot won't hurt understandability that much.
Edited by tellur, Jun 11 2012, 06:23 PM.
My Interslavic shortly - no i/y disinction and o/e rule enforced (byti>biti x biti>biti, svežego x dobrogo), soft consonants ń, ĺ, ď, ť, ŕ, ě/e merged, ę->ja, no syllabic r/l (torg, deržava, volk, dolgi), tl/dl clusters preserved (midlo, metla), CroC, CloC, CreC, CleC (grod, glova, breg, mleko), 1st sg. ending -u, 3rd pl. ending ut/jat (delaju, čuju, molvju x delajut, čujut, molvjat). Basically, a heavy Western flavour with some Eastern elements.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
IJzeren Jan
Member Avatar
Jan van Steenbergen
True, ot- won't hurt understandability at all, but neither will od-, for that matter.

Thing is only, for a language to be consistent, it's design criteria must be consistent. For NS the choice for ot- makes sense because it adopts its vocabulary straigt from OCS. But for us it's a bit different and we need a pretty damned good reason if we want to overrule the majority and pick a minority solution.

Mind, sometimes such a decision is justified. For example, the preposition dľa has most 4 votes, but it's completely not understand by the remaining two, while za is understood by everybody. Same goes for vy- vs. iz-. However, in this case I really can't think of any reason at all.
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
steeven
Member Avatar

bandziol20
Jun 11 2012, 07:58 AM
What is a plural form of -ski ending ? I'm asking because I've found such examples like :
Code:
 
SeverIrlandskje protestanisti i katolikisti North Ireland protestants and catholics t 1
Sauditskja Arabija Saudi Arabia 1 1
morskja stena seawall n 1
Britskje Devicove Ostrovi (.vg) Virgin Islands British land n 1


These are some of our earlier forms and will be changed.
Thanks for pointing those out!
-_-
Please consider 3 levels of "tests" for word formulation:

1. Logical, Analytical or Commonly Slavic
2. That it "makes sense" - to the people (not just the creators) - "will the people both accept & use it?"

3. Avoid "conflicts"
www.MEDŽUSLOVJANSKI.com - Grammar
www.INTERSLAVIC.info - Lexicon
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
bandziol20
Member Avatar

Hugh ? So - what is a standard : britske lekari ? britsci lekari ? or what ?
Edited by bandziol20, Jun 13 2012, 06:56 AM.
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
iopq
Administrator
britanske
Bo v c'omu žytti pomiž baletom i svobodoju zavždy potribno vybyraty svobodu, navit' jakščo ce čehoslovac'kyj general.
Sergij Žadan "Anarchy in the Ukr"
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
bandziol20
Member Avatar

Ok : so it's : britanski (m.), britanska (f.), britansko (n.) and britanske (plural for all genders) ?
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
iopq
Administrator
bandziol20
Jun 13 2012, 07:13 AM
Ok : so it's : britanski (m.), britanska (f.), britansko (n.) and britanske (plural for all genders) ?
yeah so each one gets a different ending
Bo v c'omu žytti pomiž baletom i svobodoju zavždy potribno vybyraty svobodu, navit' jakščo ce čehoslovac'kyj general.
Sergij Žadan "Anarchy in the Ukr"
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
IJzeren Jan
Member Avatar
Jan van Steenbergen
That's what I still believe is the best and easiest solution.

But technically, if we really follow the majority, then the plural has always -e in the nominative and accusative, with one exception: masculine nominative -i. I've mentioned this in the grammar as an optional solution.

But I still believe MS shouldn't be any more complicated than any of the native languages, and fact remains that several languages have only one ending for both the nominative and the accusative in all genders.
Človeku, ktoromu je trudno s soboju samim, verojetno tož bude trudno s vsim inim.

Slovianski - Словянски - Словјански
[čćч]
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
bandziol20
Member Avatar

IJzeren Jan
Jun 11 2012, 03:24 PM
iopq
Jun 11 2012, 11:31 AM
hell, ot- everywhere seems even better since it's consistent with otrubi/otvoriti
od UK, BE, RUE, PL, CSB, CZ, SK, SL, SH, MK = 4,5 votes
ot RU, DSB, HSB, BG = 1,5 votes
Well, to make clear : I'm not for ot, but for od, but this whole counting votes is very funny. :D
Heh... iopq feels inconsistent with these otruby, otvor, though they are from Jurassic epoch ; he likes "uravnilovka" anyway.
Glasovanje je čista gluposť. Voting is a pure nonsense.
Pišem slovjansky. I write Slovianski.

http://www.conlangs.fora.pl/index.php
http://steen.free.fr/interslavic/dynamic_dictionary.html
http://dict.interslavic.com/index.jsp
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Create your own social network with a free forum.
« Previous Topic · Fonologija i pravopis · Next Topic »
Add Reply