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Suiton
Topic Started: Oct 16 2011, 01:52 PM (860 Views)
Tsukioni
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Nffyaoi<3
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:45 PM
Argh you quoted me before I edited my post all the way. :( Come respond so we can discuss this in a civil manor.
Suiton hits too hard to be counter-able. That's my problem with it.
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Fox
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Tsukioni
Oct 16 2011, 03:55 PM
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:45 PM
Argh you quoted me before I edited my post all the way. :( Come respond so we can discuss this in a civil manor.
Suiton hits too hard to be counter-able. That's my problem with it.
If the damage was reduced would it still be effective or would it become a water gun? Suiton's primary attribute is it's burst damage, if it's primary attribute was taken away it'd become a tickle cannon.

The issue with suiton from the responses aren't really that it hits to hard. It's how it hits. ATM it acts like a revolver that you have to cock every time.

Cock Bang - Cock Bang - Cock Bang

Suiton should work more like a musket.

Prime Cock Bang - Prime Cock bang

It needs that extra opening for the counter attack. Can you define a hard counter for any of the suiton moves besides it's elemental weakness (Excluding pretty shiny wave) since blocking no longer works? For the sake of my up coming example let's say no.

What sution needs is not a reduction in damage but longer hand seal times. If that isn't enough to balance it out then make the hand seals more vulnerable to be interrupted from attacks.

TL;DR Keep suiton's high damage but give all of it's jutsu a above average to high hand seal time.
Edited by Fox, Oct 16 2011, 04:07 PM.
http://users.pop.umn.edu/~matt0350/images/forumcrap/october/scream.pdf
Someone once said "be the you you wanna be", and that's just how I feel now to.
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Stryke
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S.Dot
Quote:
 
TL;DR Keep suiton's high damage but give all of it's jutsu a above average to high hand seal time.


While giving it a longer handseal it would still make people with speedy trait will still have machine guns instead of muskets

Only thing I can think of is giving Sution users a longer stun time after using a jutsu....and extra longer if outside of water.
Edited by Stryke, Oct 16 2011, 04:12 PM.
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Fox
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Black Mask
Then add the ability for them to be interrupted as well. The interrupted might have a few kinks at first but I think that's what suiton needs.

Because it hits hard, and fast sution users like to run next to you and fire the jutsu at you since they home they don't need to face you so they don't need any prep time; and it gives you no time to defend. That increased hand seal time should give you enough time to A) Smash their face in. B) GTFO the way.

That extra stun time after using a jutsu could also work well with an added negative to suiton users.
Edited by Fox, Oct 16 2011, 04:15 PM.
http://users.pop.umn.edu/~matt0350/images/forumcrap/october/scream.pdf
Someone once said "be the you you wanna be", and that's just how I feel now to.
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Uharuu
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D.J Aruu
Stryke
Oct 16 2011, 04:10 PM
Quote:
 
TL;DR Keep suiton's high damage but give all of it's jutsu a above average to high hand seal time.


While giving it a longer handseal it would still make people with speedy trait will still have machine guns instead of muskets

Only thing I can think of is giving Sution users a longer stun time after using a jutsu....and extra longer if outside of water.
No, suiton is not oped.
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parasite47
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Kage
does suiton even home anymore or is it just guided to target like kiro shurikens were if you click someone exactly it homes or atleast appears to home
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Fox
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Please say why it isn't or is OP, the one sentence hard headed lines are annoying.

To hopefully stop this back and forth nerf buff crap there really needs to be a discussion so im just going to delete your post because it really adds nothing to the conversation if people keep doing it.

@Parasite i'd also like to know that to I wouldn't think it's homing would have been changed but i'd also appreciate it if someone could confirm if it does or doesn't.
Edited by Fox, Oct 16 2011, 04:19 PM.
http://users.pop.umn.edu/~matt0350/images/forumcrap/october/scream.pdf
Someone once said "be the you you wanna be", and that's just how I feel now to.
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Uharuu
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D.J Aruu
It's not oped because All you got to do is spam X. Only thing op about Suiton is when people over cap and hitting 3k.
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Vejolta
Metallica!
sharks are fairly difficult to hit with all of them (unless your'e standing still for some reason)

only OP thing about suiton is water fang, i was hit for 1k damage by it once xD and that's vit

as for stam damage, it's pretty cool but it's not really that strong of an element, you can run right out of daibakufu, it has one of the shittiest supers in the game, only baku and dragon/sharks are any good o.o
Though its adorable, gotta remove the Gif~Vash
Thats a whole lotta poon~Vash
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Uharuu
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D.J Aruu
Water Fang is not even op either Vejolta, all you got to do is don't stay still and stay off the water.
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Vejolta
Metallica!
still hits for a lot of damage. lol
Though its adorable, gotta remove the Gif~Vash
Thats a whole lotta poon~Vash
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Uharuu
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Vejolta
Oct 16 2011, 05:05 PM
still hits for a lot of damage. lol
Because people overcapped, don't blame suiton. Blame the over cap shit.
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-Spike-
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Kage
k suiton isn't op. *makes suiton/raiton uchiha*
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Wolfenstein
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H4x
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:38 PM
Tsukioni
Oct 16 2011, 03:18 PM
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:12 PM
I might not know what im talking about do to my absence, but as someone said earlier up Suiton often gives the impression of being OP because it does all of it's damage at one time or in extremely quick burst as seen with the sharks. (Exception shiny water fall of pretty).

This more or less makes it easy to use or user friendly and most things that are easy to use and user friendly are generally OP.

So lets get super technical with this with a map of sutions +'s and -'s and compare them to the most balanced element (In your opinion). I'd do it myself but I haven't been here for a while. I'll start with the map of suiton!

Homing Techniques +
Burst Damage +
Deletes Katon +

Block -
Water Tiles Required -
Deleted by doton -

Even amount of +'s and -'s (We're of to a good start :D)
Suiton now has a passive that allows it to be made off water; if you go full suiton, you'll have op damage and off water abilities.

Plus they have another passive to increase their sharks.

Block doesn't do shit anymore when the normal damage unblocked is 2k+

Doton deletion is based off knowledge, and no one is pure doton or even has doton.
Add those onto the list, say more weaknesses if you know them to.

I'd like it for full differences to be seen between the elements. Suiton's focus would be burst damage, Katon's should be DoT Damage, Fuuton's should be utility, Raiton's should be crowd control, and Doton's should be defensive.

The above statement doesn't have much to do with suiton being OP but it does give me another idea for a topic :D?

Because atm to "nerf" what suiton something else would have to be buffed, or a lot of things would have to get nerfed. Otherwise that "But this is stronger than that nerf/buff plox." reflix well kick in.

Argon & Korona have several options if they chose to look into the complaints. Well they rework the mechanics of suiton, well they reduce suitons overall damage or give people more stamina? It'd be nice if their was a test server that they could do this in isolation and try out all three.

But it's annoying to hear that this or that is OP without someone saying exactly what is OP about it. It's like a kid in school saying that they don't understand what exactly do you not understand?"

What exactly is wrong with suiton? Does it hit to hard? Is blocking it ineffective? Does it hit to fast? etc etc
Suikoudan is homing but you have to manually click the place for them to go.


Also it's kinda funny that Abura hasn't killed me with his 15 sharks but then again I have doton.


Which according to Tsukioni, nobody has. Maybe that's why I'm not complaining about Suiton...because I actually have defensive jutsu.
Vejolta
Oct 16 2011, 04:58 PM
only OP thing about suiton is water fang, i was hit for 1k damage by it once xD and that's vit
Jutsu is based on suiton mastery, meaning for them to hit for that much they have to overcap it. Which probably makes all their other jutsu monstrous.
Edited by Wolfenstein, Oct 16 2011, 05:58 PM.
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Tsukioni
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Nffyaoi<3
Alerion
Oct 16 2011, 05:57 PM
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:38 PM
Tsukioni
Oct 16 2011, 03:18 PM
Fox
Oct 16 2011, 03:12 PM
I might not know what im talking about do to my absence, but as someone said earlier up Suiton often gives the impression of being OP because it does all of it's damage at one time or in extremely quick burst as seen with the sharks. (Exception shiny water fall of pretty).

This more or less makes it easy to use or user friendly and most things that are easy to use and user friendly are generally OP.

So lets get super technical with this with a map of sutions +'s and -'s and compare them to the most balanced element (In your opinion). I'd do it myself but I haven't been here for a while. I'll start with the map of suiton!

Homing Techniques +
Burst Damage +
Deletes Katon +

Block -
Water Tiles Required -
Deleted by doton -

Even amount of +'s and -'s (We're of to a good start :D)
Suiton now has a passive that allows it to be made off water; if you go full suiton, you'll have op damage and off water abilities.

Plus they have another passive to increase their sharks.

Block doesn't do shit anymore when the normal damage unblocked is 2k+

Doton deletion is based off knowledge, and no one is pure doton or even has doton.
Add those onto the list, say more weaknesses if you know them to.

I'd like it for full differences to be seen between the elements. Suiton's focus would be burst damage, Katon's should be DoT Damage, Fuuton's should be utility, Raiton's should be crowd control, and Doton's should be defensive.

The above statement doesn't have much to do with suiton being OP but it does give me another idea for a topic :D?

Because atm to "nerf" what suiton something else would have to be buffed, or a lot of things would have to get nerfed. Otherwise that "But this is stronger than that nerf/buff plox." reflix well kick in.

Argon & Korona have several options if they chose to look into the complaints. Well they rework the mechanics of suiton, well they reduce suitons overall damage or give people more stamina? It'd be nice if their was a test server that they could do this in isolation and try out all three.

But it's annoying to hear that this or that is OP without someone saying exactly what is OP about it. It's like a kid in school saying that they don't understand what exactly do you not understand?"

What exactly is wrong with suiton? Does it hit to hard? Is blocking it ineffective? Does it hit to fast? etc etc
Suikoudan is homing but you have to manually click the place for them to go.


Also it's kinda funny that Abura hasn't killed me with his 15 sharks but then again I have doton.


Which according to Tsukioni, nobody has. Maybe that's why I'm not complaining about Suiton...because I actually have defensive jutsu.
Vejolta
Oct 16 2011, 04:58 PM
only OP thing about suiton is water fang, i was hit for 1k damage by it once xD and that's vit
Jutsu is based on suiton mastery, meaning for them to hit for that much they have to overcap it. Which probably makes all their other jutsu monstrous.
You're the only fag with doton. fag
Quote:
 
(Undergo) - undergo: god knows im not gonna become victim to ur bull s*** shannanigans

Quote:
 
My calculations are meticulous and precise, and there is hardly ever any errors. - Yaku

Quote:
 
(Stanley1992) - Aidonia: i dont think ur that smart in all honesty
(Stanley1992) - Aidonia: my inteligence is more potent than urs will ever be

Quote:
 
(Sva) - SHADOW: it should be coded for Tsukioni to be perma muted

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