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| When Did Aerith Sense Cloud Wasn't Himself?; at the date right? ... i dont think so, | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 21 2011, 07:22 PM (692 Views) | |
| Jon Snow | Sep 21 2011, 07:22 PM Post #1 |
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khaleesi ♥
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So, due to recent LTDs I've been in for the last couple of days, I've had people saying Aerith doesn't know the real Cloud so she couldn't possibly love him for who he really is-- rendering her love empty. I'm not sure about anyone else, but I know that we use Maiden and the date (and a few quotes from nomura) to prove she knows who Cloud really is and still loves him. But I just realized... Aerith knew Cloud wasn't like Zack by the time she got to Gongaga. (however you spell it) - AERITH: "I was a little surprised that this village was Zack's birthplace! Although called my first love, that doesn't mean that we became particularly intimate. I encountered him by chance as a flower vendor in Midgar. It was good for a little while, so I thought. A friendly, childish SOLDIER, who gave kindness to girls. I encountered Zack and began to think that even a good natured person was from Shinra. Therefore, 5 years ago, when Zack departed somewhere on a mission and he seemingly disappeared, I cried considerably. Yeah, I call this first love. Mother got angry at Zack when she saw me like that. That matter made him completely at fault. At first when I met Cloud, I believed he was similar to Zack. Little actions, the way he spoke... his kindness. But Cloud is Cloud. I, now undoubtedly, love Cloud much more than Zack. But Cloud is clueless." - DISMANTLED - see the heavy font sentence? I always assumed that the date was the first Time Aerith ever came to the conclusion that Cloud was his own man. But she realizes it at the time they arrive in Gongaga. Which, to me, proves her love to be even more real and honest for Cloud. Did anyone else ever notice this? Notice that Aerith realized and accepted Cloud as Cloud and debunked her own self conflict that he was like Zack in the first place? I sure as heck never noticed it before.
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| myfinalfantasy | Sep 22 2011, 01:46 AM Post #2 |
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Je t'aime
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Well, when Aerith met Cloud, she saw the similarities between him and Zack. She knew that they did certain things in a certain way, but she knew he wasn't himself. Remember, there are many instances where Cloud has many visions/dreams/flashbacks that don't really make sense. He's still trying to find out what's going on and why he is having these sightings. He also acts strangely, and this is noticeable to everyone. Anyways, he's partially being controlled by Sephiroth, and the only way he can free himself from Sephiroth's grasp is if he finds his true self. After Aerith died, Cloud finally regained himself after the Lifestream event with Tifa, who was given the chance to go into Cloud's memories and sort them out with the help of Aerith. Aerith knew Cloud was his own person and could make his own decisions; she just sensed that he was lost and didn't know who he was. But umm, I'm not really sure how she automatically knew, but since she is a Cetra, I'm guessing those Cetra-powers of her helped her a bit. :lol: |
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| Lady Lifestream | Sep 22 2011, 03:02 PM Post #3 |
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Der Ruf des Kolibris
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Well, I don't think Aerith had much difficulties to see that Cloud wasn't Zacks, especially because Cloud has a really calm and cool personality while Zacks is a very cheerful and happy-go-lucky character. Cloud only based his memories, persona, motions, habits, and fighting style on Zacks - the rest remained intact. The point is that Aerith didn't just discover that Cloud wasn't Zacks (obviously, he isn't) but more that Cloud himself thinks he is Zacks. This is actually much more difficultly to see because the hints are so subtle.
While I think it wasn't said in FFVII, Kingdom Hearts mentions that she has the ability to see the hidden truth in peoples hearts and their actions; therefore, she is a bit like a seeress, I think. She is the only one that realizes that the Hollow Bastion she lives in in Chain of Memories is actually an illusion of Soras Heart, and she is the only one who still knows the name of Radiant Garden. Also, without Cloud saying something about it, she knows that he wants to search for Sephiroth again. Also, interestingly, she vaguely knows about Cloud being at the Coliseum while worlds are between them, intending that they have a special, mostly spiritual bond that connects them even through other dimensions. Also, she advises Sora to guard his memories when neither she nor Sora himself nor the player could be possibly aware of the fact that this will become a major part of the storyline and a problem to Sora. In FFVII, it's said that she knows about this "hidden truth" because of her Cetra heritage, but nothing more about it. |
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| Anastar | Sep 22 2011, 03:22 PM Post #4 |
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To touch the light I see in your eyes...
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There's one quote where SE comes right out and says that Aerith knows the real Cloud because of her Cetra abilities: I'm looking for you."..."So you won't have a breakdown." - what Aerith told Cloud reveals many deep meanings. Aerith detected that the present Cloud is not the real him during their encounters. She knows it because of her mysterious, inherent ability. ~page 29, FFVII Ultimania Omega Her "mysterious, inherent ability" has to mean her powers as a Cetra. So apparently, Aerith knew it soon after meeting Cloud. And yes, I'd noticed that in the passage you quoted in the first post. It shows that she knew the real Cloud by the time they got to Gongoga. It says the similar things in several places of the FFVII Ultimania Omega: When Aerith thinks of Cloud and Zack's similarities, she sees that the present Cloud is not the real Cloud. Her meaningful lines like, "I'm searching for you" and "I want to meet you" all mean that she has discovered the existence of the real Cloud, although he's not aware of it himself. ~page 31, FFVII Ultimania Omega "So you won't have a breakdown..." - Aerith appears in Cloud's dream, and she seems to console him with such advice. This line can infer that Aerith has seen through to the essence of Cloud. ~page 156, FFVII Ultimania Omega If Aerith has seen through to the essence of Cloud, then she knows who he really is. There's also a passage that says she could see the differences between Cloud and Zack: Although in the beginning, Aerith felt close to Cloud is because he behaves like Zack, her interest in Cloud himself grows and is attracted to him. ~page 31, FFVII Ultimania Omega So I don't think there was any question that Aerith could see the differences between Cloud and Zack. |
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| Jon Snow | Sep 22 2011, 04:18 PM Post #5 |
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khaleesi ♥
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Yeah, Aly I know of those and the question at hand isn't whether or not Aerith sensed the real Cloud... it's when. xDWhen Aerith thinks of Cloud and Zack's similarities, she sees that the present Cloud is not the real Cloud. Her meaningful lines like, "I'm searching for you" and "I want to meet you" all mean that she has discovered the existence of the real Cloud, although he's not aware of it himself. ~page 31, FFVII Ultimania Omega That doesn't specify an exact time, tho. "So you won't have a breakdown..." - Aerith appears in Cloud's dream, and she seems to console him with such advice. This line can infer that Aerith has seen through to the essence of Cloud. ~page 156, FFVII Ultimania Omega Yeah, I've seen that one too. but it takes place at the dream. Which means her and Cloud are no longer together physically.But all of the quotes you provided focus around the date or the dream scene. Both in which take place right when Aerith is about to die. Which means a Cloti can say sure Aerith wanted to know the real Cloud but she had no time to do so. I just find it so interesting that this quote of Aerith saying Cloud is his own man takes place so early on in the game. (at Gongaga) that means Aerith (and Cloud) had more time to develop a bond/relationship while Aerith knew to get to the real Cloud. Aerith was distinguishing Cloud from Zack early on, and this quote proves she had a lot more time after that to get to know and fall more in love with the real Cloud. This is why I wanted to bring this up... A year or so ago when I was debating at Quex's forum for the LTD one of the Clotis had tried to bring up that it was nice that Aerith wanted to get to know the real Cloud but since she soon died afterward her wish never came true so she "died not knowing the real Cloud". At the time, that really annoyed me. I hate when people downplay the other character's love for someone else. But at the time, even though I showed them those exact quotes it still didn't prove that Aerith was able to know Cloud for a decent amount of time after she realized what was wrong with him. So when I saw this quote of Aerith saying (and so early in the game) that Cloud wasn't like Zack and that she still loved him more... I was like jackpot! So, yes, we all know Aerith sensed Cloud wasn't himself... but this quote allows us to prove Aerith did so earlier on in the game, which means she and Cloud have longer to make their relationship more genuine (which some Clotis like to say they don't have). I'm not saying it wasn't genuine before, but you wouldn't believe how many Clotis still try and say Aerith didn't know the real Cloud.
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| Anastar | Sep 22 2011, 04:31 PM Post #6 |
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To touch the light I see in your eyes...
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True that the two you quoted don't specify a time. BUT this one: I'm looking for you."..."So you won't have a breakdown." - what Aerith told Cloud reveals many deep meanings. Aerith detected that the present Cloud is not the real him during their encounters. She knows it because of her mysterious, inherent ability. ~page 29, FFVII Ultimania Omega Says she knows the present Cloud isn't the real Cloud because of her "mysterious, inherent ability", which has to mean her abilities as a Cetra. If she knew it because she's a Cetra, then she had to know it from the start because her Cetra abilities were always there, same as your ability to smell or see. But you're also right that the quote in your first post shows that she knew it by Gongaga. I'm just saying she had to know it before that time if she knew it because of her Cetra abilities. She can't turn her Cetra abilities on and off.
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| Jon Snow | Sep 22 2011, 04:38 PM Post #7 |
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khaleesi ♥
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haha, yeah, i get what you mean now Aly. xD But Clotis will always want specifics. And for those Clotis that still deny that Aerith knew the real Cloud, this for sure stumps them. Like C/T debaters would say there's no quote saying she knew it so we can't assume it. Which is safe to say. But it's awesome to have a quote about it so early in the game that helps prove she loves the real Cloud. ![]() And thanks for getting back everyone ;3 |
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Notice that Aerith realized and accepted Cloud as Cloud and debunked her own self conflict that he was like Zack in the first place?



and the question at hand isn't whether or not Aerith sensed the real Cloud... it's when. xD
8:17 AM Jul 11