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| Standing Up For Torture; Why? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 16 2005, 08:33 AM (510 Views) | |
| eb belote | Oct 16 2005, 02:40 PM Post #16 |
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corky52 i aint forgot |
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| cmoehle | Oct 16 2005, 04:07 PM Post #17 |
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Chris - San Antonio TX
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Corky, can you repeat for us your favorite torture for terrorists? |
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Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order. --Barry Goldwater | |
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| corky52 | Oct 16 2005, 04:23 PM Post #18 |
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Chris, You confuse means of execution or imprisonment of a duly convicted criminal with the torture of a prisoner. |
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| cmoehle | Oct 16 2005, 04:37 PM Post #19 |
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Chris - San Antonio TX
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Oh, ok, failed to make the distinction between torturing unconvicted prisoners and convicted ones. |
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Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order. --Barry Goldwater | |
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| corky52 | Oct 16 2005, 04:42 PM Post #20 |
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Conviction makes the prisoner in to a criminal and subject to punishment that society wishes to deal out. Infliction of pain for information versus the infliction of pain in retribution, big difference. |
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| eb belote | Oct 16 2005, 04:53 PM Post #21 |
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corky52 i think all the prisoner the terrorist executed was tryed |
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| campingken | Oct 17 2005, 10:45 AM Post #22 |
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Ed, Remember when the Marine shot the wounded "terrorist" on national TV? As they say 2 wrongs don't make a right. Either we are the "civilized" nation in this fight or we are not. I agree with Johm McCain on this topic. Ken |
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| TexasShadow | Oct 17 2005, 01:10 PM Post #23 |
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Jane
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it's hard to fight a war against people who have different standards of civility and remain true to your own standards. but, as far as I know, we did it in WW2 with the japanese and germans and again with the N Koreans. As I said before, we have to define what torture is. I still don't think that the humiliating stuff that was done to arabs in prison over there can be defined as torture. That doesn't mean I think it was okay. It was, in fact, a very trashy thing to do that gave the army a very black eye, making it look like hundreds of our soldiers were low class jerks. But there are low class jerks in every segment of our society, so there's bound to be some in the army, too. But torture is when you use physical, savage violence or cause permanent mental damage. (in my book) |
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| roscoe | Oct 17 2005, 01:21 PM Post #24 |
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How much more mentally damaged can a body bomber get. |
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| TexasShadow | Oct 17 2005, 02:23 PM Post #25 |
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Jane
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a body bomber is not a torturer. he/she is a soldier, waging war in what seems to be a very effective (morale wise) way because it's so hard to see them coming. waging war is a nasty business, period. we used guerilla warfare against the british and they called it uncivilized. the mentally damaged body bomber has been brainwashed by his own people. |
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| 5thwheeler | Oct 17 2005, 03:07 PM Post #26 |
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Get the message?
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Is Torture good? Yes if its our kids doing the torturing, whether it be to extract information, or just plan old fun. Is Torture bad? Yes, if the other guy is torturing our kids to extract information, or just having fun, then we scream foul play and expound on the Geneva Convention. Is Insurgency good? Yes, if our nation was overrun by a superior and overwhelming force, and anything short of insurgency could be considered collaboration. We all know collaboration is bad and its OK to torture them. Is Insurgency bad? Yes, if we are the superior and overwhelming force that over ran another nation, and the only way to fight back against an overwhelming force is gorilla warfare... oops... I mean insurgency, although in my mind its the same thing. Is strapping on a belt of bombs and killing the enemy good? Yes, if the enemy possesses overwhelming force and is occupying America, and all we have to fight with is our small arms and some explosives. One heroic American can take out several of the enemy. Makes good sense to me. Is strapping on a belt of explosives and killing the enemy bad! Yes, if your the target, then its considered unthinkable and immoral. It all boils down to a differing point of view. ![]() What I find most interesting are people who expound on the Geneva Convention, but from their posts its obvious they never read it. The following is Article 3 of the Geneva Convention Article 3 In the case of armed conflict not of an international character occurring in the territory of one of the High Contracting Parties, each party to the conflict shall be bound to apply, as a minimum, the following provisions: 1. Persons taking no active part in the hostilities, including members of armed forces who have laid down their arms and those placed hors de combat by sickness, wounds, detention, or any other cause, shall in all circumstances be treated humanely, without any adverse distinction founded on race, colour, religion or faith, sex, birth or wealth, or any other similar criteria. To this end the following acts are and shall remain prohibited at any time and in any place whatsoever with respect to the above-mentioned persons: (a) Violence to life and person, in particular murder of all kinds, mutilation, cruel treatment and torture; (b) Taking of hostages; © Outrages upon personal dignity, in particular, humiliating and degrading treatment; (d) The passing of sentences and the carrying out of executions without previous judgment pronounced by a regularly constituted court affording all the judicial guarantees which are recognized as indispensable by civilized peoples. 2. The wounded and sick shall be collected and cared for. An impartial humanitarian body, such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, may offer its services to the Parties to the conflict. The Parties to the conflict should further endeavour to bring into force, by means of special agreements, all or part of the other provisions of the present Convention. The application of the preceding provisions shall not affect the legal status of the Parties to the conflict. The Geneva Convention in its entity. By the way, did Iraq sign the Geneva Convention, and if so, who ran Iraq when it did? |
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History 101: When a popular myth is believed to be factual, teach the myth. Its not possible to underestimate the intelligence of the voting populous. Hummm, after seeing the results of the 06 election, I may have to modify my perception of the voting populous and refer to them as "Late Bloomers".
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| 5thwheeler | Oct 17 2005, 03:12 PM Post #27 |
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Get the message?
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Good question, if it was America under siege, the so called mentally damaged one would be a hero. Not much different then running up against a machine gun nest to take a hill. Are we the brainwashed ones? |
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History 101: When a popular myth is believed to be factual, teach the myth. Its not possible to underestimate the intelligence of the voting populous. Hummm, after seeing the results of the 06 election, I may have to modify my perception of the voting populous and refer to them as "Late Bloomers".
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10:35 AM Jul 13