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A World Without Religion; Soapbox
Topic Started: Jun 4 2006, 09:00 AM (548 Views)
Tom
Member
If we did not have religion in the world. Would we be better off? There would be no Rag Heads causing trouble. Religious leaders condemning others for there belief or non beliefs. What makes these people think they are so perfect. They go to church one day a week and act like an A$$ the rest of the week. :whistle:
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cmoehle
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Chris - San Antonio TX
Religion is an inevitable confrontation of the unknown, so, even as science advances our knowledge, I don't think we can ever do without.

The problem with religion is not religion per se, liberty of conscience is a natural right. The problem is with some of its leaders and followers, a few fanatical rag head terrorists, a few fanatical religious leaders condemning others.
Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order.
--Barry Goldwater
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TexasShadow
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Jane
if there were no religion in the world, man's nature would be different.
religion springs from man himself, asking basic questions like:
why am I here and how did I get here and is this all there is?

maybe there are no real answers to these questions. maybe all religions are based on wishful thinking, but the fact that man does ask these questions makes him different from the animals.

man can look around himself and perceive that he is part of something much bigger than himself. he is aware of belonging to some kind of natural order.

I think there are two, very basic reactions to this perception.
One is the desire to live in peace and harmony with everything around us.
The other is the desire to control and manipulate the natural order to our personal judgement of what is good for us... our personal satisfaction.

Religion flows from both of these reactions.
Posted Image "A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking."
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wylifox
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wylifox
Religion is where our morals com from. We removed religion from our schools and now they are not safe. Our Country was based on religion.
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Lon Frank
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Jane pretty well nailed it again. "religion springs from man himself"

I started a book once, titled 'The Tyranny of Religion'. It began with the sentence, 'In the beginning, man created God in his own image.'

Religion was and still is, a substitute for science - for the darkness at night, for the void in knowledge, for the heartache if loss, the unfairness of tragedy. We need religion on a very basic level, as man has proven to be a religious animal, and that alone perhaps segregates us from all others. Even Gnostic Environmentalist Pagans have our own form of a belief system which sustains us in times of wonder. The problem comes when religion becomes (as it always does) an instrument of exclusivity. A system of intolerance, an extablished order of truth, a 'Gospel' rather than a hope.

We have recently discussed at length here, the innate nature of man towards religious institutionalization. We have argued whether our morals are based on religion, or whether religion is based on inherent morality. There is an ever-widening gap of disagreement.

(As to 'rag head' religions, John Updike has a new book due to be released soon, titled, I think, 'Terrorist'. Should be a good read for those with open minds.

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cmoehle
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Chris - San Antonio TX
wylifox
Jun 4 2006, 11:03 AM
Religion is where our morals com from.  We removed religion from our schools and now they are not safe.  Our Country was based on religion.

Simply not so. Morals, like religion, originate in man. About the only religious principle our godless Constitution adopts is religious freedom.
Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order.
--Barry Goldwater
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Tom
Member
Guess what I am trying to say. Seams all these religious groups around the world including the ones in the USA. Think there way is the best. Pat Roberts condemn other religions. Baker had a $$ making thing going. You got the ones who say there God does not want violence and then they go out a murder people in name of there God. You see people you know go to church. Next day they are messing around or making trouble for others. Churches make a lot of money off it's followers. New of one my mother belonged too. There pasture DEMANDED payment from his people.
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cmoehle
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Chris - San Antonio TX
No, I think you're right, a lot of bad apples, but there are good ones too. You know, we argue religion here, a lot, too much some think, but it's all in good spirit, and I have a lot of respect and admiration for these people even in disagreement.

Glad to have you join us. Jump in any time.
Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order.
--Barry Goldwater
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Banandangees
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"religion springs from man himself,"

"Morals, like religion, originate in man."

Just what is it in "man" that causes him (most) to have this thing well up and spring out of him? Was it always there...inborn? Did it originate in him as Chris says or was it put there? How did it get there to begin with to make it such a universal, inate conscienceness through time?

"..man can look around himself and perceive that he is part of something much bigger than himself. he is aware of belonging to some kind of natural order."
Banan
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cmoehle
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Chris - San Antonio TX
"Just what is it in "man" that causes him (most) to have this thing well up and spring out of him?"

Self interest, which demands adherence to the golden rule, which predates religion.

Even if as you might claim, they are religion-given, meaning, I suppose, God-given, if man was not naturally, innately capable of morals, how would he ever be able to understand and practice them? Let's not put the cart before the horse.
Politics is the art of achieving the maximum amount of freedom for individuals that is consistent with the maintenance of social order.
--Barry Goldwater
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TexasShadow
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Jane
Quote:
 
Just what is it in "man" that causes him (most) to have this thing well up and spring out of him?


well, being a believer, I think the ability to think these questions and perceive oneself as part of a larger thing... comes from God.


Posted Image "A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking."
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pentax
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Kamloops - BC Interior
TexasShadow
Jun 4 2006, 08:54 AM
religion springs from man himself, asking basic questions like:
why am I here and how did I get here and is this all there is?..... man can look around himself and perceive that he is part of something much bigger than himself. he is aware of belonging to some kind of natural order.


There are days when I wonder if the whales and porpoises didn't get together long ago and decide "Oh, screw it - let's go swimmin'?"

;)
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Posted Image

"Kirk to Enterprise - Very funny, Scotty.... now beam down my clothes!"
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TexasShadow
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Jane
Quote:
 
There are days when I wonder if the whales and porpoises didn't get together long ago and decide "Oh, screw it - let's go swimmin'?"


:) :clap:
Posted Image "A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking."
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bikemanb
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Liberal Conservative
The problem isn't religion but rather how people chose to practice it and get off on the tangent that when it said God so loved the world he gave his son, they thought it meant only their sect was loved and feel obligated to at best explain the error of our ways to the rest of us if not try to force us.
Bill, Rita and Chloe the Terror Cat

For having lived long, I have experienced many instances of being obliged, by better information or fuller consideration, to change opinions, even on important subjects, which I once thought right but found to be otherwise.

Benjamin Franklin
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Colo_Crawdad
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Lowell
As in politics, the problem in religion is the difference is between the authoritarians and the non-authoritarians, those who believe that man is basically innately good as opposed to those who believe that man is basically innately bad.
"WE HAVE MET THE ENEMY AND HE IS US." --- Pogo
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