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US Foreign Policy
Topic Started: 27 Dec 2007, 04:24 PM (287 Views)
Wraith
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What's your opinion on the current US foreign policy? To see some of my personal opinion, see the Lakota Sovereignty topic, page 3. Anyways, I'll elaborate more here:

You know what'll happen if we leave the world in the dust? Here's what will likely happen if the US goes isolationist again, for all the idiots who think that US "meddling" is a bad idea:

Iraq = a Fucking SLAUGHTERHOUSE. If we leave, either the Sunnis and Shiites will destroy the nation in a civil war, or Iran will come in, set up a puppet government, and be a hero, slaughtering the Sunni population of Iraq.

Yugoslavia = Another slaughterhouse. If anyone's ever heard of Milosevic, someone else will take his place. I doubt anyone here has cared about Yugoslavia AT ALL

Genocide the world over. It's already happening, but if we leave and go isolationist like before WWI and WWII, something on the scale of the Holocaust will happen. Because we are not intimidating those insane racist lunatics, a "neo-Hitler" will rise.

Darfur = Truly not much of a genocide, more of a mass population displacement. The reasons the US government isn't caring is not because of Iraq it's because:

1. What the hell is in Sudan? Nothing we care about.

2. Somalia 1993. They don't want us there. Hell, a worse Darfur is happening in Somalia, but we care even less there, because last the entire UN tried to help, politics got in the way. The Africans don't want the help of the White Man of the West, it just makes things worse in their opinion.
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Astro_Death
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Thing is,we can't just isolate ourselves like before.With globalization and the fact that nearly all of our resources and industry come from outside the country,isolation is bad.We have jumped into a pit too deep to climb out of to pull ourselves back into isolation.
"Nothing in democracy is perfect." - Oscar Arias
"I cant stand idly by while poor people get free food! We gotta sell these things!" - Bender
"Finally, we'll have something more reliable than a government document!" - Stephen Colbert
"Justice may fail in one's lifetime, but it will eventually win in the cours"e of history." - Kim Dae-jung
"Trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to argue with a dining room table. I have no interest in doing it." - Barney Frank
"Nobody knows we're here... so...let's wreck the joint!" - Tommy Tiernan, on the Universe
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Alkeni Synair
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Astro_Death
Dec 27 2007, 04:54 PM
Thing is,we can't just isolate ourselves like before.With globalization and the fact that nearly all of our resources and industry come from outside the country,isolation is bad.We have jumped into a pit too deep to climb out of to pull ourselves back into isolation.

I concur.

OFMG I agree with A_D!
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Michael Irick
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If we left Iraq, what would happen? There might be a civil war. There might not be. If you ask me, there is already civil war. Who knows, maybe it will split into a couple nations like it should be. Kurdistan is basically independent as it is now.

Yugoslavia will deal with itself the way it did before: it will break up into smaller nations.

Quote:
 
Somalia 1993. They don't want us there. Hell, a worse Darfur is happening in Somalia, but we care even less there, because last the entire UN tried to help, politics got in the way. The Africans don't want the help of the White Man of the West, it just makes things worse in their opinion.


Neither Iraq nor Yugoslavia nor Germany nor Iran nor Japan nor Pakistan wants us there. The only people who benefit are those who stand to make money off it. Why do we need to police the world if they don't want us?

Neo-Hitler? Are you serious? Neo-Hitler? If a neo-Hitler did arise, what would happen? His enemies would fight him. Would he be successful? No, because you cannot win an occupation. Look at France in the early 40s. It looked under control, but it was the second most expensive thing Germany did, second only to the invasion of the USSR.

It is very expensive to run an Empire. Rome found out. Spain found out. Britain found out. France found out. Russia found out. It is only a matter of time before it gets too expensive to work.
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Alkeni Synair
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michaelirick
Dec 28 2007, 12:30 AM
It is very expensive to run an Empire. Rome found out. Spain found out. Britain found out. France found out. Russia found out. It is only a matter of time before it gets too expensive to work.

But rome did not fall because of internal revolts, it fell because of external invasion. Get your facts right.

And Empire done properly can last a Hell of a long time.
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Michael Irick
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But lack of money was a cause of internal revolts within the Roman Empire, and yes, Empire can last a while. The American Empire has been in existence since 1865, and it's getting pretty near bankrupt. Ever heard the phrase "national debt?"
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Alkeni Synair
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michaelirick
Dec 28 2007, 02:26 AM
But lack of money was a cause of internal revolts within the Roman Empire, and yes, Empire can last a while. The American Empire has been in existence since 1865, and it's getting pretty near bankrupt. Ever heard the phrase "national debt?"

A.) What Internal Revolts? You mean the wars for who would be emperor? They are not Revolts, they're Dynastic Wars.
B.) We've survived with a crushing debt, and chances are, we'll keep on surviving,
C.) We could just Raise taxes to the Clinton Level, then funnel the extra money into paying the damn debt, instead of wasting it on Tax Cuts,, which by themselves aren't bad, BUT THE RICH GET ALL THE MONEY!
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Kai
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The other thing i disagree with is Israel. We have no right to help them hold that land. And make no mistake we prop them up. If they want it they can fight for it but it's none of our business.
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Alkeni Synair
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Kai
Dec 28 2007, 12:22 PM
The other thing i disagree with is Israel. We have no right to help them hold that land. And make no mistake we prop them up. If they want it they can fight for it but it's none of our business.

Look, It may have been a mistake in the first place, but the thing is, we can't just leave them now. Besides, if they fought for it without our help, We'd get another holocaust on our hands.

Thing about it, don't just spout opinions.
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Astro_Death
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Rome fell for a bunch of reasons,not just one.Both of you are right.Revolts,economic problems,barbarians,you name it.Anyway,this about the good ol' US of A and not the Roman Empire :P

American Empire...Wow,aint that stupid -_- What are you doing?Playing Civ4? :lol:

This isn't the ealry 1900s anymore.Globalization is the fashion now and people can't keep to themselves.The USA is just in way too many places to just leave.As for Iraq,that place has literally been a place of violence for centuries.It isn't going to stop,democratic or not ;)
"Nothing in democracy is perfect." - Oscar Arias
"I cant stand idly by while poor people get free food! We gotta sell these things!" - Bender
"Finally, we'll have something more reliable than a government document!" - Stephen Colbert
"Justice may fail in one's lifetime, but it will eventually win in the cours"e of history." - Kim Dae-jung
"Trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to argue with a dining room table. I have no interest in doing it." - Barney Frank
"Nobody knows we're here... so...let's wreck the joint!" - Tommy Tiernan, on the Universe
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KamikazeCow
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I don't support total isolationism, but as I don't like government, I'm not going to bother going in depth because I will get crounded here.
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Wraith
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Kai
Dec 28 2007, 11:22 AM
The other thing i disagree with is Israel. We have no right to help them hold that land. And make no mistake we prop them up. If they want it they can fight for it but it's none of our business.

It's our obligation to do so. We got ourselves into a deep pit with Israel, one we cannot get out of.

1. Just about everyone in the world had sympathy for the Jews after WWII and therefore supported the Zionist movement

2. Because of Reason #1, we were obligated to give Israel aid in their many struggles against the Arabs

3. The Cold War brought the Soviets into arms dealings with the Arabs, and to continue to counterbalance Communist Power in the Middle East, we were obligated to continue to aid Israel

4. Israel and Kuwait are our only true friends and footholds in the Middle East. Therefore, we are obligated to help them
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Alkeni Synair
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#1-#4: I totally agree
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