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Why Federalisim works
Topic Started: 27 Dec 2007, 11:21 AM (359 Views)
Alkeni Synair
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Redefining Evil
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See Revolutionary Continental Congress: FAILURE
See Articles of Confederation: FAILURE
See Confederate States of America: FAILURE
See U.S Late 19th Century: FAILURE
See 1960s: FAILURE

I win :rock:
Work in progress.
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Kai
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Learn2ParisCommune = WIN
wat?
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Alkeni Synair
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Last time I checked, The paris commune lost....

I WIN
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Michael Irick
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Quote:
 
See Revolutionary Continental Congress: FAILURE
See Articles of Confederation: FAILURE


Those were the same thing as of 1777. But anywho....

Quote:
 
See Confederate States of America: FAILURE
See U.S Late 19th Century: FAILURE


These two met their ends due to the same reason: usurpations of power. The Republican party rose to power in the election of 1860 as we all know. The Democratic party was divided allowing a party which controlled some northern States to gain the majority of electoral vote.

Several southern States seceded due to a regional party coming into the presidency which was decisively anti-southern. Abraham Lincoln sent a fleet of ships to fortify Ft. Sumter. The fleet was kept out of the harbor by rough seas. Seeing the danger of allowing the ships to enter the harbor, the Charleston militia called for the surrender of the fort. When the fort refused, they opened fire and the fort was surrendered on very generous terms. One Union soldier was killed during the cannon salute while lowering the flag.

Lincoln then called forth troops to return the fort to Union control. Several more States seceded stating that coercion is unconstitutional and morally wrong. Then a bloody war commenced killing 1 in every 4 southron and imposing a military occupation that lasted 10 years and a depression that lasted many more decades.

Whoever calls that war worth it has not studied it nor the principles of liberty.

Source: Rise and Fall of the Confederate Government by Jefferson Davis, president of the Confederate States of America
Empire of Zeon
Deonios Seon
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Alkeni Synair
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You're wasting your time citing a source as biased as Jefferson Davis?

That war was worth it.

A.) Precedent
B.) Together, the north and south are more powerful than apart
C.) We don't need those southerns who died. Godsfucked rascist libertarian inbreeders, the lot of them.
D.) What do you expect. I say we should have been harsher on the south, If i was in charge, Davis would have been publically stoned.
E.) The southern Deppression lasted the Military occupation, ONLY. In the 1890s the south was doing JUST FUCKING DANDY!
F.) That proves my point: Federalist nations will always win over 'confederacies' and 'free nations' and libertarian nations, by the end of the Civil War, the SOuth was copying many northern practices to try and survive!
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Michael Irick
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My source is credible because he is a primary source. I would much rather choose to read the history by Lord Acton, but I can't find it. I have read books with the bias for the Union, so I read one by Davis to get both sides of the war and found that Davis's points had a deeper intellectual, not to mention legal, basis.

I agree that the southern States were copying the northern States to some degree. Why? Because industrialization was becoming more profitable. In business, the idea is to make money.

There was still depression after "Reconstruction," it wasn't as bad, but it still counts as depression. It was not bad if compare it to the Great Depression, but it was still bad. Compare the southern States to the other States from the time between the 1870s and 1920s.

Your argument basically amounts to "might means right" where the big government is the best. That means that men should fear the government and when that happens there is tyranny. If that is to happen with all nations, then I say we should go without nations altogether.

Now, the generalizations are left. I would like to ask that you keep them out of your argument, please.
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Deonios Seon
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Alkeni Synair
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Quote:
 
Now, the generalizations are left. I would like to ask that you keep them out of your argument, please.


Not quite sure what you mean... :hmm:

No, I'm not saying Tyranny is any better. Read Alexander Hamilton sometime. Take a look, and I mean a GOOD look, at the Federalist Papers that Hamilton and Jay wrote, not just the ones that the Fucking Traitor Madison wrote.

Also, read Ron Chernow's Biography of Hamilton.

IF, you agree to read those, I'll agree to read two books on Libertarianisim, That YOU choose.

I Think It will be good for both of us.
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Kai
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Alexander Hamilton
Dec 27 2007, 09:49 PM
Last time I checked, The paris commune lost....

I WIN

Lost because it was 2 on a bajillion odds... but they didnt fall apart on their own.
wat?
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Alkeni Synair
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They still lost because they had horrible odds because they didn't try and get others to join them, becuase most people are smart enough not to go crazy like the parisians

I win.

Bloody Anarchists.

Bloody Libertarians

Bloody People for the U.S South

Bloody Communists.
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KamikazeCow
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Alexander Hamilton
Dec 27 2007, 09:49 PM
Last time I checked, The paris commune lost....

I WIN

It was defeated, not a failure.

Also, the title: Just because something works doesn't mean it should be followed.
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Alkeni Synair
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KamikazeCow
Dec 28 2007, 07:00 PM
Alexander Hamilton
Dec 27 2007, 09:49 PM
Last time I checked, The paris commune lost....

I WIN

It was defeated, not a failure.

Also, the title: Just because something works doesn't mean it should be followed.

What, and always Fail? What kind of society is that?
Work in progress.
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KamikazeCow
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Alexander Hamilton
Dec 28 2007, 11:58 PM
KamikazeCow
Dec 28 2007, 07:00 PM
Alexander Hamilton
Dec 27 2007, 09:49 PM
Last time I checked, The paris commune lost....

I WIN

It was defeated, not a failure.

Also, the title: Just because something works doesn't mean it should be followed.

What, and always Fail? What kind of society is that?

I don't know what society you're talking about in this, but...

Even if a society is perfect, and does not fail (see: Yugoslavia (federation, by the way ;) ), it can still be militarily defeated. It doesn't matter how perfect a society is; if it is outgunned, it will fall. Has nothing to do with the general crappiness/coolness of said society.
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Wolfe
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What's Switzerland? I think it's a federation, however I'm sure someone told me it's a confederacy.
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Michael Irick
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Officially, yes, it is the Swiss Confederation. I like Switzerland, every house has to have a machine gun BY LAW!
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Deonios Seon
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Wolfe
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That's a terrible law. Even if the State pays for these weapons. Then it just gives the state another reason to tax people.

I checked it out switzerland's a federation.
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