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Wonder Who? The Mystery Man?
Topic Started: 26th August 2008 - 10:45 AM (765 Views)
Son of chicken balti pie
Member Avatar
One and only original Creep
Matt
Aug 29 2008, 02:13 PM
Son of chicken balti pie
Aug 29 2008, 02:00 PM
Matt
Aug 29 2008, 11:35 AM
As far as i'm aware we are now debt free. As much as you don't like Bates, he didn't say how he was going to get debt free.

By the end of that 2 year period quoted by you, we are not paying the big earners, agreed?

We seem to be making a profit as we are now in a position to pay transfer fees again, agreed?

The £12m investment has nothing to do with the fans unfortunately, they invested on the basis they will make money, i would guess that when the club is sold they will get their share plus whatever profit they make or don't make. The money was used to buy the club and it was used to take away some of the debt. You may not believe it but Bates cut down the debt by a good £40m or so in the first season. One question that i would like answered is if Bates is such a crock, why didn't he put the club in admin - when the clubs had much more favourable conditions to fulfil when exiting admin too - straight away? He could have wiped off nearly £60m of debt in one go.

Player sales - running costs? the club still needed money to function, maybe also trying to reduce the wage bill?

Compensation - did you read what i put earlier? £4m compo went towards the £140k a week loss that i mentioned earlier..... and i was being conservative by using 4 week months instead of actuals.

Lots of unanswered questions, but who's to say they need answering?

But the club were achieving gates above the much vaunted 22,000 break even figure. Break even means attendance required to meet all our outgoings. We were achieving that, according to Bates own words before the admin. Then the story changed.

As for Bates clearing 40M in his first season, sorry, but complete hogwash.

When Bates took over, the debt - total debt was £18M - that figure again came from Bates mouth at his first "Lorimers Bar" event. Krasners consortium sold everything not nailed down. Bates detailed the debt down to IR, ex employees etc etc.

He then, in 18 months managed to increase that debt to nearly double, based chiefly on the supposed money paid in by the off shore comapanies, and in spite of continued player sales, and an appearance at cardiff, and above break even crowds. I did indeed read what you put - to be blunt I find it hard to accept the premise of £140K weekly losses set against the above facts

Oh, and dont forget the odd half million to our own Radio Station!!!

He risked the very future of our club in some selfish ego trip, or worse, to clear the decks for his Leeds village project.

He has lied and lied and lied again, and I fail to see how anyone can take his utterances with an ounce of credibility.

If he does indeed start to take the club forward on the pitch, then all I can say is about bloody time, because to date, Bates tenure has been marked with crisis after crisis, downsizing and the sight of the club disintegrating before our eyes.

One bad season, and we will be lost in the wastelands for years to come, IMO.

The worrying thing is, many feel that is exactly what Bates requires for his Property interests to truly reap dividends.

£40m is the figure i had quoted to me, not connected to the club, believe it or not that's your wish.

22,000 was/is the break even figure for running costs, but that was day to day running costs i believe. Not the figure needed to break even taking into things such as the rent payments, interest payments on debts etc etc. The debts and sales of the ground being Krasner/Ridsdale/Previous board members fault.

Total debt could well have been £18m but does debt stay in the same place all the time? If it does i need to speak to my bank.

I feel that Bates engineered extra debt to other places to help himself, yes you read it right, i don't particularly like the way he did it but he did it to keep control so he didn't lose lots of cash. Most people would do the same.

I've asked it before but i don't really expect it answered, if the debt was at the £40m+ i think it was or even the £18m you heard why did Bates not take it into admin straight away? It would surely have saved himself money and would also make Leeds more financially attractive to buyers.

And as for Bates' property interests, in order to make the arse end of Beeston attractive property wise, their needs to be a good football club there, because whatever people say that area of Leeds isn't worth as much without the ground there as the amount of visitors to that area would be nil if the ground disappeared.

Bates may tell lies, but the club is in a better financial position now then when Krasner was around. Football wise, obviously not, but we're getting back to it slowly.

I truly hope you are correct. I dont pretend to understand all the shit that has surrounded the club.

I am simply a fan who is sick to death of the lies and the bullshit that seem to go hand in glove with our club. I have met the lead players at our club - Bates Harvey, etc, and to be blunt, in my opinion they are unfit to have the future of LUFC in their hands.

As said, if we are eventually moving forward, then all well aand good. You could argue that it was all a means to an end - well based on the means we have all endured, it had better be a bloody good ending!
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Matt
Member Avatar
Dee's a liar....
Son of chicken balti pie
Aug 29 2008, 02:20 PM
Matt
Aug 29 2008, 02:13 PM
Son of chicken balti pie
Aug 29 2008, 02:00 PM
Matt
Aug 29 2008, 11:35 AM
As far as i'm aware we are now debt free. As much as you don't like Bates, he didn't say how he was going to get debt free.

By the end of that 2 year period quoted by you, we are not paying the big earners, agreed?

We seem to be making a profit as we are now in a position to pay transfer fees again, agreed?

The £12m investment has nothing to do with the fans unfortunately, they invested on the basis they will make money, i would guess that when the club is sold they will get their share plus whatever profit they make or don't make. The money was used to buy the club and it was used to take away some of the debt. You may not believe it but Bates cut down the debt by a good £40m or so in the first season. One question that i would like answered is if Bates is such a crock, why didn't he put the club in admin - when the clubs had much more favourable conditions to fulfil when exiting admin too - straight away? He could have wiped off nearly £60m of debt in one go.

Player sales - running costs? the club still needed money to function, maybe also trying to reduce the wage bill?

Compensation - did you read what i put earlier? £4m compo went towards the £140k a week loss that i mentioned earlier..... and i was being conservative by using 4 week months instead of actuals.

Lots of unanswered questions, but who's to say they need answering?

But the club were achieving gates above the much vaunted 22,000 break even figure. Break even means attendance required to meet all our outgoings. We were achieving that, according to Bates own words before the admin. Then the story changed.

As for Bates clearing 40M in his first season, sorry, but complete hogwash.

When Bates took over, the debt - total debt was £18M - that figure again came from Bates mouth at his first "Lorimers Bar" event. Krasners consortium sold everything not nailed down. Bates detailed the debt down to IR, ex employees etc etc.

He then, in 18 months managed to increase that debt to nearly double, based chiefly on the supposed money paid in by the off shore comapanies, and in spite of continued player sales, and an appearance at cardiff, and above break even crowds. I did indeed read what you put - to be blunt I find it hard to accept the premise of £140K weekly losses set against the above facts

Oh, and dont forget the odd half million to our own Radio Station!!!

He risked the very future of our club in some selfish ego trip, or worse, to clear the decks for his Leeds village project.

He has lied and lied and lied again, and I fail to see how anyone can take his utterances with an ounce of credibility.

If he does indeed start to take the club forward on the pitch, then all I can say is about bloody time, because to date, Bates tenure has been marked with crisis after crisis, downsizing and the sight of the club disintegrating before our eyes.

One bad season, and we will be lost in the wastelands for years to come, IMO.

The worrying thing is, many feel that is exactly what Bates requires for his Property interests to truly reap dividends.

£40m is the figure i had quoted to me, not connected to the club, believe it or not that's your wish.

22,000 was/is the break even figure for running costs, but that was day to day running costs i believe. Not the figure needed to break even taking into things such as the rent payments, interest payments on debts etc etc. The debts and sales of the ground being Krasner/Ridsdale/Previous board members fault.

Total debt could well have been £18m but does debt stay in the same place all the time? If it does i need to speak to my bank.

I feel that Bates engineered extra debt to other places to help himself, yes you read it right, i don't particularly like the way he did it but he did it to keep control so he didn't lose lots of cash. Most people would do the same.

I've asked it before but i don't really expect it answered, if the debt was at the £40m+ i think it was or even the £18m you heard why did Bates not take it into admin straight away? It would surely have saved himself money and would also make Leeds more financially attractive to buyers.

And as for Bates' property interests, in order to make the arse end of Beeston attractive property wise, their needs to be a good football club there, because whatever people say that area of Leeds isn't worth as much without the ground there as the amount of visitors to that area would be nil if the ground disappeared.

Bates may tell lies, but the club is in a better financial position now then when Krasner was around. Football wise, obviously not, but we're getting back to it slowly.

I truly hope you are correct. I dont pretend to understand all the shit that has surrounded the club.

I am simply a fan who is sick to death of the lies and the bullshit that seem to go hand in glove with our club. I have met the lead players at our club - Bates Harvey, etc, and to be blunt, in my opinion they are unfit to have the future of LUFC in their hands.

As said, if we are eventually moving forward, then all well aand good. You could argue that it was all a means to an end - well based on the means we have all endured, it had better be a bloody good ending!

We agree on something at least..
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